The AIM-9G, SEAM and YOU!

[+Dave 2,322]

What is SEAM and how does it affect you?

 

SEAM is Sidewinder Expanded Acquisition Mode. It was introduced to the AIM-9G. This is what it does;

 

"Allows the optics either to be slewed through a search pattern, or to be slaved to the aircraft's radar to acquire a target."

*Information gathered from Raytheon website...

So I got to thinking, "Did TK put this feature in the sim?"

 

I loaded up a mission set in 1972, flying the F-4B_67. I jumped on Mig-21's tail, set the radar to boresight mode, locked him up, selected a winder and without tone, I fired. Keep in mind this Mig-21 was in the process of a tight left turn that I couldnt hold with him. The winder jumped off the rail went wide left and smakced him right in the fuselage. Very cool. However, had to test it again, this time 1v1 vs Mig-19, started on his six, he pulled hard right so my winder tone dropped off. I had already got a boresight lock on him and I fired. Winder jumped off the rail went right, hit him in the cockpit. I lathered, rinsed and repeated this 6 more times for a total of 6 for 8 kills. So I am thinking TK might of added this feature. Does anyone want to give this a go and let me know the results?

 

Finally the AIM-9G is an improved AIM-9D and this did work with the AIM-9D, however the AIM-9D didn't have SEAM in real life, so if this feature is in there then the AIM-9D needs to be adjusted to not have SEAM. Thoughts?

[+Spillone104 553]

I don't know if there is something like that for the sidewinders but just noticed that with exp.2 the AIM-9E/E-2 and AA-2D have much better performances than before, like a wider sector of engagement, and most important they don't follow the heat source but preceed the intercept point.

BTW the Firestreak and Red Top use radar command to steer their IR sensors in the game as it was in real life.

[+EricJ 4,245]

I've used radar to cue (myself mainly visually) 9Xs during engagements, or stick with padlock most of the time.

[MigBuster 2,884]

hmmm interesting will give that a try.

 

Yes good point on the Lightning missiles - they are pretty good - no doubt TK feels people are happier when the missile hits things.

Edited January 6, 2011 by MigBuster

[+Dave 2,322]

I've used radar to cue (myself mainly visually) 9Xs during engagements, or stick with padlock most of the time.

 

Yeah that isnt the same. You have to use the AIM-9G in 1972 because the G wasnt all aspect like the AIM-9X is which doesnt use or need SEAM. SEAM doesnt exist anymore with the advent of better AIM-9 missiles.

[+EricJ 4,245]

Ahh okay.

[JediMaster 451]

Oh, so prior to the 9G the seeker couldn't be slaved to the radar?

 

I really haven't noticed it myself because if I'm in a plane with a radar with boresight mode I always use it in ACM, no matter what weapon I use. If the plane has no radar, then I don't.

However, I've never even thought of firing a 9 without tone.

[+Dave 2,322]

Oh, so prior to the 9G the seeker couldn't be slaved to the radar?

 

No it couldnt unless you were firing the AIM-9C which was a radar guided Sidewinder.

 

I really haven't noticed it myself because if I'm in a plane with a radar with boresight mode I always use it in ACM, no matter what weapon I use. If the plane has no radar, then I don't.

However, I've never even thought of firing a 9 without tone.

 

Well the key JM is that you have to have the target locked in boresight mode which in ACM mode it does the same thing . Then you can fire. You have to use F-4 and its must be the AIM-9G or H. Try it and let me know.

[FrankD 7]

Thanks for the head up Dave, I clearly overlooked this ability from the start.

 

Would you know what the "Seeker Uncage" ability to mean in gameplay terms?

[SFP1Ace 33]

Fellas, I've just checked EXP2 with weapon editor and all sidewinders from AIM-9G onwards do have seeker slave and seeker uncaged fields ticked (unlike -B, -D or -E models). So wasn't this functionality implemented before?

[+Dave 2,322]

Fellas, I've just checked EXP2 with weapon editor and all sidewinders from AIM-9G onwards do have seeker slave and seeker uncaged fields ticked (unlike -B, -D or -E models). So wasn't this functionality implemented before?

 

If it was I didnt notice it. What peaked my interested was reading about what SEAM was then trying it out.

 

Thanks for the head up Dave, I clearly overlooked this ability from the start.

 

Would you know what the "Seeker Uncage" ability to mean in gameplay terms?

 

Frank

 

Here is a good thread about the AIM-9 I dug up and it talked about uncaging the seeker. Hope this answers your question.

 

http://combatace.com/topic/16642-heat-seekers-uncaged-mode/

[FrankD 7]

Thanks Dave, I'm gonna read it asap.

[JediMaster 451]

Oh, so only the F-4 had it? I'll have to make sure not to try it with another plane then!

[Caesar 305]

Jedi,

 

SEAM wasn't limited to the F-4. I'm not sure how many planes were compatible with SEAM, but I know early model F-14A's were (Ref: F-14 Tomcat, J.P. Stevenson, 1975 p.87) before the arrival of the AIM-9L. There is actually a light on the ACM panel which reads "SEAM LOCK". It wouldn't surprise me if there were other aircraft that had SEAM compatibility, but as it has been pointed out, SEAM became unnecessary with the arrival of the all-aspect Sidewinder.

 

I'll have to try this out in-game when I set my computer back up in zee new apartment!

[+Dave 2,322]

Jedi,

 

SEAM wasn't limited to the F-4. I'm not sure how many planes were compatible with SEAM, but I know early model F-14A's were (Ref: F-14 Tomcat, J.P. Stevenson, 1975 p.87) before the arrival of the AIM-9L. There is actually a light on the ACM panel which reads "SEAM LOCK". It wouldn't surprise me if there were other aircraft that had SEAM compatibility, but as it has been pointed out, SEAM became unnecessary with the arrival of the all-aspect Sidewinder.

 

I'll have to try this out in-game when I set my computer back up in zee new apartment!

 

Yes I did do a SEAM launch from an F-14. Knocked a Mig-23 out of the sky with it.

[bwild 5]

AV-8A Harriers seemed to have had the capabilties according to Killerbee (see http://combatace.com/topic/42487-harriers-roadrunner-method/page__p__301914__hl__seam+harrier__fromsearch__1?do=findComment&comment=301914)

 

Don't know how it would work without a radar, as the Harrier doesn't have one.

[bwild 5]

I can't get it to work, but I don't have the expansion packs. I suppose it was added in the Lightning add-on? Or should it also work without the packs?

[+Dave 2,322]

AV-8A Harriers seemed to have had the capabilties according to Killerbee (see http://combatace.com...__1#entry301914)

 

Don't know how it would work without a radar, as the Harrier doesn't have one.

 

I thought the Harrier had a gun ranging radar? If so then that could do SEAM as well IIRC.But I'm not sure. If Gunny said it could then it could.

[bwild 5]

I thought the Harrier had a gun ranging radar? If so then that could do it SEAM as well IIRC.

 

That would explain it.

[+Dave 2,322]

I can't get it to work, but I don't have the expansion packs. I suppose it was added in the Lightning add-on? Or should it also work without the packs?

 

Can you give me an idea of what procedures you did?

[bwild 5]

Can you give me an idea of what procedures you did?

 

Took an F-4J loaded with AIM-9Gs in 1972 against MiG-17s.

 

1 Used boresight to attain a lock on a MiG in a slight banking turn

2 Selected the AIM-9G

3 Fired before the tone changed

4 The sidewinder went straight ahead not aqcuiring the target

 

Perhaps I should wait a bit longer at step 3, I'll try that now. Would be extremely cool to get this to work.

[+Dave 2,322]

You did right. More testing is needed I think.

[Vambrace 1]

@Bwild

 

I did the same procedure when using the AIM-9G and it works well for me. here is the pic to show how it works.

 

http://combatace.com/gallery/image/17896-aim-9g/

 

@Bwild and Dave

 

I tried to see if the SEAM function is actually in game and I come across one conclusion. When I tried it with the merged installs + EXP1 only, the AIM-9G and other IRM that have 180 rear aspect function the same way as all IRM with 60 rear aspect lock which they fly straight with no tumbling motion you normally see in an all aspect IRM.

 

When I installed EXP2, I see a major improvement to the IRM that have 180 rear aspect. I test fired the AIM-9E and G models (one do not have seeker slave and the other does), and both missiles intercept their targets the same way an all aspect would in addition to the tumbling motion that the all aspects possess.

 

From the looks of it, looks like rear 180 IRM's now have some kind of limited all aspect capability of some sort. Not that they can lock-on in a head on but it greatly improves the Pk compared to rear 60 IRM's.

 

On a note to Bwild, looks like this function only works once you get EXP2. I dunno if it will work if you patch it to dec.2010c but i'm not willing to try it because of the "over the airfield" bug. I dunno but i may need someone to correct me on the patching part.

[+331Killerbee 840]

In 1972, The Marines recived their first AV-8A's at MCAS Beaufort. They were the first Marine Aircraft to have "SEAM" installed. They Installed the Boxes on Stations 1 and 5 first thing as the Aircraft were being accepted. All other Aircraft recived "SEAM" shortly thereafter. It was to take advantage of the new AIM-9L Seekerhead Improvments. The AIM-9L was released in 1971.

 

A "SEAM" Box is about half the size of a Tissue Box. It connects Between The Sidewinder Harness inside each Pylon. It also controls extra Nitrogen needed for the AIM-9L's G&C from the LAU-7's Bottle.

 

"SEAM" doesen't require Radar to opperate. But having Radar is a Bonus.

 

The "SEAM" Boxes is what I helped the RAF and Royal Navy install back in 1982. And We all know what they did using the AIM-9 "Limas". The worst part of the Install was the building of two 32 pin Connectors for each Pylon. It was a Pain...

 

 

Just some Notes......

 

 

331KillerBee

[+Dave 2,322]

As I said, KB knows Aim-9"s....