+Dave 2,322 Posted April 20, 2008 I request that you keep in mind that the soldiers, sailors, airmen, and Marines who run toward the fight, leave behind those in uniform who would rather not. Ain't that the truth, I run into those everyday. You know being away from my family is one thing but if I have to go, then I have to go and I am not about to run from it. It's what I signed up to do. I just would like to see some light at the end of the tunnel. Hell I have volunteered so much to deploy I had my CO tell me to stop flooding the deployment section with requests. I will get my time though. Doing 6 months is better than what I have been doing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Jarhead1 27 Posted April 20, 2008 I pulled 3 tours over in the litterbox so I went non Deployable until i get out. I did my time over there and now as far as I am concerned, the slackers that tried to skate out of it can pull their weight and go and spend some time over there but thats just another of this jarheads opinions and rants. sorry to bore everyone but thats just my take on one of the problems of the military. Jarhead Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krgf15 1 Posted April 20, 2008 I know the Army is doing 12 to 15 months, on a tour, but how long are the Marines going? Do they have an average tour, or do the just do it like a TDY? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Jarhead1 27 Posted April 20, 2008 average tour is 7 months, and i feel sorry for the army guys, but we each end up doing the same amount of time over there eventually, it all adds up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WarlordATF 1 Posted April 20, 2008 (edited) As a civilian, I Want to Thank everyone who has enlisted in any branch of the US Military. I can live my life the way i choose because i know you guys are watching over us. Even i can see the way the Country is changing and IMO its not for the better. Far too many people in power the bottom line is all that matters anymore. Its everywhere and often human considerations take a backseat to "How much will it cost?". We are living in a time where the eggheads have the power and its sadly funny to see them fail miserably. This nation needs Leaders who are considered men of action, not bankers. We need people to look up to, but recoginition of real heros is few and far between in todays society. I can't and won't speak about todays Military conditions, because i don't know enough and have not served. I signed up for selective service like everyone else and if called i wouldnt have tried to get out of it, but its just not the life for me, i have issues with authority figures and a stubborn streak than would have gotten me locked up or beaten regularly. The sad fact i can see is we are selling our souls because its cheaper than taking risks, Any real American will tell you thats not what this Nation was built from. Its kinda scary to think of where we are headed in the future if this trend continues, Life is about alot more then the almighty dollar, but the Banks run the show now and if you can only break even at something then its a waste of time. Look at Hollywood for example, they keep turning out remakes instead of taking chances on new ideas because some accounting exec has convinced the studio that (Insert TV or Movie license Here) will make a profit based on its existing fanbase. What ever happened to "Who Dares Wins" ? Once again, Thank You All for your Service and Godbless, I Hope that one day our Nation can become what it once was. Edited April 20, 2008 by WarlordATF Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Dave 2,322 Posted April 20, 2008 but its just not the life for me, i have issues with authority figures and a stubborn streak than would have gotten me locked up or beaten regularly. ....or killed in combat. I found over the years, that you have to check some of that stuff at the door to get the job done, or you may be responsible for getting someone killed or getting yourself killed. One thing though, is that you can admit it. Its the ones who can't that are the most dangerous. I can say this Warlord, we appreciate the public support and thank you for it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hawk MMS 0 Posted April 21, 2008 (edited) Thoughts on this? Defense Secretary Gates Says Air Force Must Step Up Efforts in Iraq, Afghanistan Monday , April 21, 2008 WASHINGTON — Defense Secretary Robert Gates said Monday the Air Force is not doing enough to help in the Iraq and Afghanistan war effort, complaining that some military leaders are "stuck in old ways of doing business." Gates complained in a speech at Maxwell Air Force Base, Ala., that getting the Air Force to send more surveillance and reconnaissance aircraft to Iraq and Afghanistan has been "like pulling teeth." The Pentagon chief praised the Air Force for its overall contributions but made a point of urging it to do more and to undertake more creative ways of thinking about helping the war effort. He said he has been trying for months to get the Air Force to send more surveillance and reconnaissance aircraft, like the pilotless Predator drone that provides real-time surveillance video, to the battlefield. "Because people were stuck in old ways of doing business, it's been like pulling teeth," Gates said. "While we've doubled this capability in recent months, it is still not good enough." To push the issue harder, Gates said he established last week a Pentagon-wide task force "to work this problem in the weeks to come, to find more innovative and bold ways to help those whose lives are on the line." Edited April 21, 2008 by USMC Hawker Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krgf15 1 Posted April 21, 2008 Dosent the Pentagon tell the Air Force what to do? I know Im just a lowly E-5, but I thought Gates was our boss. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GreyCap 0 Posted April 21, 2008 I mean...look at this guy...legendary fighter pilot / tactician / warrior / looks cool / married a movie star He looks like a fighter pilot, some one you would gladly follow into harm's way...retired as a Brig. Gen...barely I'm sorry, it's not very clear to me, who's this guy? Is it general Ronald E. Keys? Whoever he is, that is one cool looking fighter pilot! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Supernova22 0 Posted April 21, 2008 I'm sorry, it's not very clear to me, who's this guy? Is it general Ronald E. Keys? Whoever he is, that is one cool looking fighter pilot! I think its Robin Olds but im not sure Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Dave 2,322 Posted April 21, 2008 Has the SECDEF lost his freaking mind?!!!!!!!!!!! WTF does he want? We got so many people deployed now we have to rob Peter to pay Paul. We got AF personnel doing jobs that the Army does because the Army can't fill them. We got the assets he wants in place. I WORK IN ONE OF THOSE UNITS THAT DOES! We don't have enough people to be everywhere because we are getting downsized. Did he miss that part? I only got 14 days left......breathe Dave breathe..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+76.IAP-Blackbird 3,557 Posted April 21, 2008 This is the bes F-4 Phantom pilot i knwo from history, this is Olds I think! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krgf15 1 Posted April 21, 2008 This is the bes F-4 Phantom pilot i knwo from history, this is Olds I think! Definately Robin Olds, I have that picture in my F-4 Spirit of the skies book, good book by the way Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GreyCap 0 Posted April 21, 2008 Definately Robin Olds, I have that picture in my F-4 Spirit of the skies book, good book by the way Woa, I think this Robin Olds is my new hero! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robin_Olds Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FastCargo 412 Posted April 21, 2008 He's considered an icon of the USAF. You always knew who the old Rhino drivers were in the squadron...cause they all looked and acted like him. Mustached, crusty, old guys who could drink you under the table and didn't give a damn who knew it either.... It's funny, we complain about the SNAPs the USAF seems to be intent on breeding. What I'm finding though is that for all the USAF leadership keeps doing, almost all of the new guys coming into the fighter/bomber force have that same killer instinct that I remember, that still gets the job done. Even if they are of the Nintendo generation...there's still hope for the future. FastCargo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Jug 99 Posted April 21, 2008 (edited) I'm sorry, it's not very clear to me, who's this guy? Is it general Ronald E. Keys? Whoever he is, that is one cool looking fighter pilot! It is the one and only Robin Olds. This picture was taken during Vietnam when nobody was getting much done and we needed a leader. You couldn't make up a story using your wildest imagination to write about the known antics of this AF legend. WWII Ace and 4 MiG kills in Vietnam. A leader leads from the front and many AF commanders haven't got the faintest idea of what that means. Robin never lost sight of it. There was not one single politically correct bone in his body. I do mean all of the Right Stuff! He passed away this year and our country has lost a real hero. Is that not one of the most beautiful mustaches in the world. The AF was leaning on everybody in the suit for the clean cut look and the commander shows up looking like a brawler. As a matter of fact, that is exactly what he was. The real leaders were interspersed throughout the Air Force and I had the privilege of serving with one at Loring AFB, Col Larry 'Streetfighter' DeVall. Loose Larry came to command a SAC wing from the Flying Club at Beale where he was a SR-71 pilot, instructor, evaluator, and squadron commander. Before that he flew B-47s and B-58s. He is remembered fondly as the light colonel that threw the piano through the officers club window at Beale after receiving a lecture from some stodgy SAC puke on operational flying (of which this dude had none). Of course his wing won the Omaha trophy as the best wing in SAC, and aced 5 operational readiness inspections, so he was passed over for BGen. Not too many PC bones in that lanky old frame either. Meandering on here, please forgive........... Edited April 21, 2008 by Jug Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Spectre_USA 7 Posted April 21, 2008 Meander on, my man! I love hearing old stories of the good leaders. I know the sensation, I hasten to add. During my time in the USAF, I really shined when we had a real mission, like when I was in USAFE. Set a record for an ICT on the A-10. But when I was stateside, with little but busy work, not so much shininess. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Spectre_USA 7 Posted April 22, 2008 I loved `em! As the crew-cheif on the load team, it was the coolest! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sparkomatic 7 Posted April 22, 2008 - Think of the John Wayne movies...Olds LIVED them...period... - Jug is exactly right, he was a warrior, period...12 kills in WWII...begged to go to Korea...went to Viet Nam and was an instant legend...not only that...he actually passed on kills because they were going to pull him out if he got 5 kills in SEA (he had 4, total being 16 confirmed kills)...so he avoided further personal glory in order to stay and lead his men... - After his tour in Viet Nam he was pulled in to other jobs...he was asked by none other than the CSAF how to "fix" the miserable USAF kill to loss ratio of 1 to 1...especially while the USN was doing fantastic after the establishment of TOP GUN...Olds volunteered to take a reduction in rank in order to go fly and fight again...at a time when so many "top leaders" were enjoying the war in Hawaii, Olds tried desperately to get back into the fight - He was also told by the CSAF himself to shave off his mustache...he did NOT... - Oh, and a fellow by the name of "Hap" Arnold (Father of the USAF) pinned his wings on him when he graduated pilot training...not to shabby - He is still, as F/C says, a legend, especially among people more concerned about doing what is right versus doing what gets one promoted (and, for the uninitiated, those unfortunately are not the same things) - He was also a famous college football player...in fact in 1985 he was enshrined in the College Football Hall of Fame...he was also enshrined in the National Aviation Hall of Fame...only person so far to hold both honors Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Jug 99 Posted April 22, 2008 I loved `em! As the crew-cheif on the load team, it was the coolest! I know what you mean Sparkomatic, the real thing is a whole different level of effort and mindset. Stateside, it is all about polishing the apple and getting somebody promoted. The guys I worked with during deployed ops were not particular standouts stateside, but became different people when engaged in real ops. My most treasured piece of my flying history is a plaque that my maintenance team gave me as my USAF Best Alternative Steering team. The U-2 tailwheel only turns 6 degrees and at times when the wind is blowing from the wrong direction, you cannot make a corner getting to the runway. The guys following along would pile out of the step van and literally push on the side of the tail to help it around a corner. I was notorious for not making at least one corner per mission at this particular location. It was like these guys said to me, "Faggetaboutit, you take care of business in the upper ether, we'll get you to the runway." Each one of those troops were not extraordinary, but I have never had a maintenance late takoff or cancel during ops. We all came together and put the best jet in the sky and never failed to bring home the bacon. It was a level of mutual respect and admiration, you don't see often in stateside training ops. Later, back home, it became a quick eye-lock, a nod, and, usually, a grin. Kinda like, we been there, done that, and done it well. Those fleeting moments are what I remember most of my service career, not the down times and the bulls***t. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krgf15 1 Posted April 22, 2008 I loved `em! As the crew-cheif on the load team, it was the coolest! yeah, but as apg crew chief, all we did was gas it and pretend to inspect it so you guys didnt run over us with the jammer Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
igor7111 0 Posted April 22, 2008 Thank you for serving. I have a son in law in iraq right now and I know the toll it's taking on his wife and little boy. Maybe if MORE people volunteered, the stress on the active duty troops wouldn't be so high. I have 17 days left, I get off active Duty 12 May and the 13th I am in the active AF Reserve. It's funny people say "Can't you stick out for until 20? That's only 3 1/2 years." Then I ask them if they have been away from their family for the last 2 1/2 years. Of course they say no, or they say they have never been away from them that long. Ok say I stick it out for another 3 1/2 years, now its 5 years I haven't been with my family. At what cost? Kids that barely know their father? A wife I have to get to know all over again and it may or may not work out? Not worth it. I will get benefits from the USAFR, I will still get a retirement. I also get benefits from my wife being active duty, and finally I am home with my family. I win all around. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
firehawkordy 34 Posted April 22, 2008 USAFMTL, this is the last thing I'll add to your thread, I promise. I've been retired for ten years this Sept., in that time I've attended retirements for both friends and my favorite unit. All agree that it was time to go when it stopped being fun. The question I asked about staying around for your full twenty wasn't for you, and it wasn't for me. It was for the folks on the outside and the kids just getting started. This is why I asked, knowing why you joined is easy, why you stay is easy, knowing when to leave- thats the hard part. The most difficult thing I ever signed in the Navy wasn't the Contract or the Re-up papers, it was that damned piece of paper that said "I'm done". I left at the right time for me, everyone leaves at the right time for them, that you still have the opportunity to keep your hand in is another winning reason. Every reason you listed is the right one and nothing is more important than family. And you're right, after listing everything in your reply to me, you win, and that's what matters in the end. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Jug 99 Posted April 23, 2008 (edited) It is the one and only Robin Olds. This picture was taken during Vietnam when nobody was getting much done and we needed a leader. You couldn't make up a story using your wildest imagination to write about the known antics of this AF legend. WWII Ace and 4 MiG kills in Vietnam. A leader leads from the front and many AF commanders haven't got the faintest idea of what that means. Robin never lost sight of it. There was not one single politically correct bone in his body. I do mean all of the Right Stuff! He passed away this year and our country has lost a real hero. Is that not one of the most beautiful mustaches in the world. The AF was leaning on everybody in the suit for the clean cut look and the commander shows up looking like a brawler. As a matter of fact, that is exactly what he was. The real leaders were interspersed throughout the Air Force and I had the privilege of serving with one at Loring AFB, Col Larry 'Streetfighter' DeVall. Loose Larry came to command a SAC wing from the Flying Club at Beale where he was a SR-71 pilot, instructor, evaluator, and squadron commander. Before that he flew B-47s and B-58s. He is remembered fondly as the light colonel that threw the piano through the officers club window at Beale after receiving a lecture from some stodgy SAC puke on operational flying (of which this dude had none). Of course his wing won the Omaha trophy as the best wing in SAC, and aced 5 operational readiness inspections, so he was passed over for BGen. Not too many PC bones in that lanky old frame either. Meandering on here, please forgive........... Speaking of "Streetfighter", here he is in front of his [really fast] jet. He's on the right and only lacks the mustache...................... Edited April 23, 2008 by Jug Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
