Pilot Body Model or not?

[Olham]

Some time ago, we had debated the question, if there should be pilot bodies modelled for the inflight cockpits.

I had voted for them, cause I thought, it would be looking much more realistic.

Only after that poll, I realised that my favourite and beloved Albatros are modelled without a pilot dummy.

I had never realised - I must have imagined it being there, but it isn't.

 

Now I have seen those beautifully refined cockpits for P4 - and I would find it a pity, if I couldn't see all this detail.

I am wondering, if it might still be time to save the devels some work of making these "bodies", by deciding new

and possibly against them? What do you all think about this?

 

(In the case, that it is all done and modelled already, I hope you won't tear my head off, Winder and Pol!)

[Slartibartfast]

I need to see my legs unless in the bar then I can be legless... but for the bar I require my arms so... need all of me...

[Hellshade]

I will say that none of the other flight sims that I play model the pilots body and I never miss them. The cockpits are all empty. I think the only reason some people miss them in OFF is because some planes have them and some do not. So the switch between planes that do and those that don't is jarring. Rather than see the Devs spend time modeling pilots bodies, I would prefer they simply remove them all and with that consistency, I believe the full immersion will return. As Olham said, he must have imagined them in his Albatros. You never miss what you never see.

 

I don't see any hands or feet in any of the pre-release P4 screenies, so I am hoping this is the route the Devs have taken. I think their precious time would be better spent on the many other improvements I am sure they are making. Bombers, better AI, scenery, re-textures, etc.

 

just my 2 cents.

 

Hellshade

Edited February 17, 2011 by Hellshade

[DukeIronHand]

I will say that none of the other flight sims that I play model the pilots body and I never miss them. The cockpits are all empty. I think the only reason some people miss them in OFF is because some planes have them and some do not. So the switch between planes that do and those that don't is jarring. Rather than see the Devs spend time modeling pilots bodies, I would prefer they simply remove them all and with that consistency, I believe the full immersion will return. As Olham said, he must have imagined them in his Albatros. You never miss what you never see.

 

I don't see any hands or feet in any of the pre-release P4 screenies, so I am hoping this is the route the Devs have taken. I think their precious time would be better spent on the many other improvements I am sure they are making. Bombers, better AI, scenery, re-textures, etc.

 

just my 2 cents.

 

Hellshade

 

Huh...I must need to broaden my OFF horizons. Which A/C models the pilots body?

[CaptSopwith]

Huh...I must need to broaden my OFF horizons. Which A/C models the pilots body?

 

I believe some of the Neiuport models have limbs in them... I want to say a few of the German fighters do as well, but I can't recall which ones... the Pfalz DIII maybe?

[RAF_Louvert]

.

 

The Strutter has this pilot body model, IIRC:

 

 

[Olham]

Isn't it funny? I bet, most of us wouldn't be able to tell, which crates have bodies.

Like me - I always had been thinking, the Albatros had them.

Fascinating, how big the part of our phantasy is.

 

PS: Oooouuuhhhh!!!! Wow, I must have missed a lot, Lou! Never been flying the Strutter. We must definitely change that!

(Although: with her as a pilot - how could I check the six?)

[RAF_Louvert]

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Hey, they have to do something to get more flyers in the B/R's.

 

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And checking the six has never been nicer.

 

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[Olham]

Aaahhmm - the six is rearwards, right? And the Strutter pilot(esse) is sitting in front of the gunner?

So, why should... oh, I think you had even naughtier thoughts!

[von Baur]

I know that in some aircraft the leg blocks the view of the compass. IRL if that was a problem I'd just move my leg slightly but that's not an option in OFF so I have to shift my head a bit. It feels unnatural. In the earlier disussion it was mentioned that in some aircraft the pilot's left hand blocks the view of the mixture lever. Since I never look inside the cockpit to see my arms or legs anyway, I vote to take them all away.

[Slartibartfast]

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The Strutter has this pilot body model, IIRC:

 

 

 

She's a cutie... and as I strut my stuff in the Strutter... its always a pleasant mornings flying...

[Olham]

...and I bet you always let her climb up the ladder to the cockpit first, gentleman as you are.

Gives you that extra rush of adrenalin you need for crossing the lines, I guess.

[Slartibartfast]

...and I bet you always let her climb up the ladder to the cockpit first, gentleman as you are.

Gives you that extra rush of adrenalin you need for crossing the lines, I guess.

Of course old chap its the correct thing to do...

[carrick58]

@#$#$ I knew that I should have flown a Strutter

[carrick58]

A pic from the hanger area. I get the impression the next flight may not go well

[Hellshade]

That pilot looks like she has natural leadership skills to me. Can you name many men who wouldn't follow her into combat?!?

 

Hellshade

[Lewie]

She's a cutie... and as I strut my stuff in the Strutter... its always a pleasant mornings flying...

 

Just set the trim wheels for a gentle turn, way to the west of the front, let nature take it's course.

[77Scout]

In my opinion the choice is obvious, given OFFs stated goal is 'as real as it gets'. If this is to be any kind of a serious simulation, the pilots body MUST be in the plane. I expect to see EXACTLY what a real pilot would see, otherwise how can this be called a simulation. Playing as a set of 'floating eyballs' in an empty cockpit hardly passes for realism or immersion in my book.

[Olham]

Good point, 77Scout - that was my earlier opinion too. Damn, this is tricky...

[Hasse Wind]

I voted yes also this time. It's not really the most important thing I expect from sims or other games, but it does bother me somewhat when we have games with such realistic graphics today, but then our character has no body and is merely a floating pair of hands carrying a gun, or in the case of flight sims, completely invisible, except when switched to external view, when he suddenly appears in the cockpit. I like the added immersion of having a body in the cockpit.

Edited February 17, 2011 by Hasse Wind

[Olham]

Yes, I see - please vote like you really feel. I know I have made up my own mind in the first post,

but mostly to explain, why I have come to a different opinion.

And now you guys shake it with your arguments again.

[Lewie]

From a 3D modeller/mod's POV if you are seeing the pilot 3D meshes from the cockpit view, you forgot to change the internal view's exclusion of the pilot's object. I had a couple of targetware models that I forgot to remove the body object from and when you 'materialized' into your cokpit view it was from within side the object's "head" which was pretty weird as certain polys that you should have seen through were showing, when you did a look down you'ld be looking at the chin and upper torso and noticing how angular it all was. I thought it was a bit creepy.

 

Besides the required morphing or keyframe modelling to make the pilot mesh move like a real body would eat up a lot of your video RAM's overhead.

[Hellshade]

I would be a lot more interested in seeing the pilots limbs if they had the kind of detail that made you feel like you were really looking at arms and legs. But when you can see it's really low resolution up so close, to me seeing that kills the immersion for me. Better to just let my imagination handle it. If the pilots body looked closer to Call of Duty than it did Star Wars: Legos, I'd agree with having it.

 

Hellshade

[RAF_Louvert]

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Star Wars: Legos

 

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[Olham]

I had a couple of targetware models that I forgot to remove the body object from and when you 'materialized' into your cokpit view

it was from within side the object's "head" which was pretty weird as certain polys that you should have seen through were showing,

when you did a look down you'ld be looking at the chin and upper torso and noticing how angular it all was.

That may be the reason why the heads are removed on some two-seaters? I think in the DFW I saw a headless gunner or pilot,

like the Hessen rider in "Sleepy Hollow".