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UK_Widowmaker

A very thought provoking Video

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beautiful video of nature at it's best and worst. the messege implied with the video is rubush though.the stuff shown isn't nessisarily cause and effect but two parralel events. nature doing her thing as she has done for millions of years and man doing some crazy crap,some nessisary some not. one is not nessisarily the cause of the other unles you believe dicredited scientists.

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actual it's way more than one or two but thats neither here nor there. Evidence and facts are lacking. everytime a prediction is made it's revised down because of faulty data or fudged data. yes we have ahuge impact on our suroundings and need to be much better stewerds of this planet for sure.We are just deluding ourselves if we think we are so powerful as to effect the globe the way the green Nazis think we do. the globe has beencooling and warming in cycles for millions upon millions of years and it's going to continue to do so. we are making global predictions and assuming things based on unreliable core sambles and 200 years of data and we are predicting things that happen in cycles that last 1000's of years.Conservation and protecting the enviourment is one of the most important things we can do but the greenies are not about that they are about social and economic "fairness" and the redistribution of wealth and power.Just read up on the whole "carbon credit" sham.it's all about getting the rich to give to the thirdworld and does nothing for the enviorment. Carbon offsets are a freekin scam. If you do some research intop the people crying the loudest for green iniciatives they are the same people who stand to make billions of the implimentation of the green policies.there is global climat change and in most reguards it's natural and there is polution and raping of the earth and while a seperate issue it is wrong and needs to be curbed.

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these videos remindme of the one they had out when I was growing up.It was moving for sure. It was a Native American crying on the side of a highway as some idiot littered. it made me not want to litter,which is a good thing. to this day I never intentional litter except on earth day. The problem with the vid was the Indian wasn't an indian he was an italian actor. he made lots of claims over the years and was discredited after a while. nobody care about him anymore.The chicken little syndrome will kick in because when these "scientist" keep crying that the galciers are melting or the ociens are rising 900 feet keep getting corrected or disproved. it makes you stop listening.

 

my spelling sucks today .....

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"I don't have anything to add"

 

I do;

 

what a crock of drivel

 

load of bull

 

mindless insanity

 

semi-religious dogma unencumbered by actual scientific facts

 

corrupt scientific hoax

 

etc.

Edited by Typhoid
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Painful to watch. But, even without the presence of Man, this eventually happen... as happened before.

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Mars' polar caps are shrinking.

 

Man isn't there.

 

Solar radiation intensity drops by the square of distance, and as Mars is ~2x farther from the Sun than Earth, it gets ~1/4 the solar energy. Yet its polar caps are shrinking.

 

Connect the dots.

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"I don't have anything to add"

 

I do;

 

what a crock of drivel

 

load of bull

 

mindless insanity

 

semi-religious dogma unencumbered by actual scientific facts

 

corrupt scientific hoax

 

etc.

 

I hope you're right Typhoid :grin:

 

Either way, I hope you know how to ride a Horse!..cos your car will be rusting metal, with nothing to fuel it before too long :bye:

Edited by UK_Widowmaker
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I hope you're right Typhoid :grin:

 

Either way, I hope you know how to ride a Horse!..cos your car will be rusting metal, with nothing to fuel it before too long :bye:

 

just drill baby, drill and then drill some more. :cool:

 

We haven't begun to strip mine the Moon and Mars yet! :grin:

 

And there is enough methane on Titan to last longer than mankind is likely to. :good:

 

In the meantime - lots of horse ranches out here too. Of course, shoveling through all of the horse-stuff isn't all that fun either. :lol:

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"I don't have anything to add"

 

I do;

 

what a crock of drivel

 

load of bull

 

mindless insanity

 

semi-religious dogma unencumbered by actual scientific facts

 

corrupt scientific hoax

 

etc.

 

You guys do realize this is not about global warming, right??

 

You guys do realize that we are watching the next mass extinction event in geologic history? (luckily there´s yet no anti-scientific-my-bartender-knows-it-better lobby to seed any irrational nonsense and abstruse crap about this fact)

 

And you do realize that we are the single driver of this mass extinction?

 

 

But, hey, as long as we can blame the corrupt scientists and finally have unraveled their world conspiracy everything’s fine now..... (btw. any scientist *might* feel offended by this kind of BS comments)

 

 

@ U_W: nice find-thanks for posting!

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Kind of in the middle on this one. Gorgeous vid. Great music.

 

Do I believe we have the ability to affect the ecology? Yes. Hell, the Precambrian extinction event occurred due to the species of the period existing and altering the atmosphere. We've clear-cut forests to make pencils, dumped entire mountain tops into rivers to dig coal, and brought herds of buffalo numbering in the millions down into the thousands. You can't tell me that human beings are not having an impact on our environment when we get acid rain, sprayed DDT, and have an area in my county fenced off with radiation signs because the state's Institute of Technology disposed of a nuclear reactor there before the '96 Olympics.

 

Do I think we're deluding ourselves into not believing that we can't? Yeah. I mean, if nothing else we're human freakin' beings, the most advanced intelligence that sprang up on this backwater swamp hole we call a home. We created weapons that could poison the entire world just because half of us didn't trust the other half or like how they lived.

 

Are there a LOT of people making money off the problems that they are either sweeping under the rug or blowing out of proportion? Seriously? We're people. That's not even a question. Look at how many "funds" there are for the environment that end up being scams. Look at how much it costs to properly dispose of a computer monitor (I used mine as a target for my shotgun. It was free.) Look at how much crackpot scientists are getting funding simply by pushing the global panic buttons.

 

Is it as bad as they say it is? Probably not.

 

Is it as blown out of proportion as they say it is? Probably not.

 

Is it getting blown out of proportion? The herd panics at the slightest sign of danger. We're a herd 7 billion strong.

 

Is regulation good? Yes. You want to leave something for your grandkids, right?

 

Is business good? Yes. You want to be able to pay for things, right?

 

The science isn't all BS. We've gotta take care of our planet at least well enough that we don't destroy it before we're advanced enough to go find another one. We're part of the biome. Plants, animals, and people are equal partners in the survival of all. But we can't get so terrified of what might happen that we shut down as an industrialized species. I like the internet and toilet paper, and I'm probably not the only one.

 

I have another solution, but it's unpleasant to contemplate.

 

 

PS, anyone need to get rid of a CRT monitor or TV, message me and I'll send you my address. J/k

 

Edit: I dunno why I get involved in these discussions. I'm here to sim and human beings are hardwired to maintain their own beliefs. I have never seen someone's political, social, spiritual, or self-held beliefs change from one end of a forum argument to the other. How many Tomcat/Superhornet bouts have we had with the same facts being volleyed back and forth? And how many of us have changed their minds? That's what I thought.

Edited by Swordsman422
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sigh...............

 

The Thermophobic-Extinction Mass Hysteria Crowd have been making doom and gloom predictions for decades.

 

NOT A SINGLE ONE has actually come about. Not one. (go ahead - find and quote one)

 

There are scientists across the entire spectrum. The Thermophobes have their pet, bought-scientists, and we have our carbon-free-funded scientists dedicated to actual scientific processes and integrity.

 

another news flash - the skeptic crowd have NOT had to fabricate their numbers, demonize their opponents, refuse to debate, black-list those who don't agree, suppress scientific studies and papers, rewrite historical records, suppress historical records, engage in criminal cover-up, fabricate fraudulant documents, mis-represent their opponents positions, etc.

 

Life goes on and will continue to do so.

 

alright - when's the North Atlantic ready for download? :pilotfly:

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got a century or 2 before oil will run low. Ihope by then we will have made some progress on other formas of energy.

I just hope that one day, we'll be able to use bulls**t as a source of energy. Some inextinguishable veins do exist. Oh yes they do!

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The Thermophobes have their pet, bought-scientists, and we have our carbon-free-funded scientists dedicated to actual scientific processes and integrity.

 

Yeah – I guess it makes the world a lot easier to understand when everything is nicely painted black and white.

 

Anyway, I´m actually tired of debating about obvious facts that get denied because they might imply something called responsibility (yet again, I´m not taking about global warming).

 

Just one last request: please read this (http://www.pnas.org/content/105/suppl.1/11579.full) and let me know who bought all those corrupt scientists (really, I mean it....knowing who buys all the studies would tremendously improve my funding situation)

 

 

That said, yepp, it´s about time to fly some Tomcats over Iceland :drinks:

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"got a century or 2 before oil will run low. Ihope by then we will have made some progress on other formas of energy."

 

Really.

 

I do hope that you can back that up with documentation, because the best estimates that I've seen indicate that we're actually in or have just passed through peak oil.

 

I would prefer some factual references.

 

I tend to get a wee bit cynical when I read opinion that according to the fossil fuel industry, there's plenty of oil left, and increases in CO2 in the atmosphere are purely a myth, despite core sampling and a fair bit of other evidence to the contrary. It very much reminds me of the tobacco industry's brave and principled fight against medical researchers who had the gall to point out that smoking cigarettes or pipes had a firm and irrefutable link to dying of lung, mouth, throat or other cancers.

 

The jury is not actually out. It's been back and given a majority opinion, and the opinion is that we do harm to the atmosphere of this planet, and degrade it. I suggest that people who think otherwise take it up with the scientific bodies concerned.

 

And, for any Brits reading this, to make this slightly lighter reading - aren't Man Utd s**te? Couldn't believe them getting turned over by Ajax. Fergie tried the 'young team' excuse, disregarding the fact that the Ajax team are actually younger than his own. A woeful performance. As a City fan, I enjoyed their discomfiture, but I find it hard to believe that they can persist with Jones and the useless Evans in their team. What midfield?

 

Cheers,

Si

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Anyway, I´m actually tired of debating about obvious facts that get denied because they might imply something called responsibility (yet again, I´m not taking about global warming).

 

Just one last request: please read this (http://www.pnas.org/content/105/suppl.1/11579.full) and let me know who bought all those corrupt scientists (really, I mean it....knowing who buys all the studies would tremendously improve my funding situation)

 

 

Ok. I suppose you think those guys all work for free? How do you think scientific studies come about?

 

http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/images/stories/papers/originals/climate_money.pdf

 

"(yet again, I´m not taking about global warming)" oh no, of course not :rolleyes:

 

here's a clue - they're all the same scientists and funding sources. They figured out that the Global Warming scam wasn't going to work (something about no warming for the last 15 years.....), so they've been trying out lots of new labels for the same idiotic anti-energy/economy eco-fascist global regime. They've shopped for;

 

Global Warming

Climate Change

Climate Disruption

Bio-Diversity

Global Wierding (that one got them laughed off of even the sympathetic editorial pages)

Sustainability (several variations)

and now the latest is Sustainable Economic Development - but it is really just all about Global Economic Fascism/Socialism.

 

Peak Oil was also in there as a subset of Sustainability - but the Peak Production of oil is an artificial result of deliberate government suppression of oil development. This is one of those government efforts to shut down new oil production - and then point to the fact that oil production has peaked. No kidding.......

 

Your mass extinction fantasy was part of the bio-diversity scam which fell apart as scientists keep finding new species that they didn't know existed, and lots of living examples of supposedly extinct species still doing just fine.

 

The biggest problem with the Eco-Fascist crowd is that they are using predictions based on theoretical models which don't actually replicate the real world. Not suprisingly, the theoretical predictions don't actually come to pass. The mass exinction fiction is based on theoretical climate predictions which have failed 100%.

 

"That said, yepp, it´s about time to fly some Tomcats over Iceland "

 

yep - let's pull chocks and load up some Tomcats for the weekend. :flyer:

Edited by Typhoid

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:salute:

Typhoid::

:

:

and now the latest is Sustainable Economic Development - but it is really just all about Global Economic Fascism/Socialism.

 

Sustainable Economic Development has been around a good while with the UN, World Bank, CIA, US State Department, USAID (US Agency for International Development), most if not all the western so-called NGO's, etc...endless list. Czech out their websites they are pretty cool if you are up on the eco-buzzwords. You just waded into the deep central core of foreign policy and you nailed it. Good call.

 

Watch the carbon trading. The giant banks are supposed to be dealers in carbon credits. I've often wondered if carbon trading could catch on to give another 30 years of life to the debt system, backing the central bank currencies if the financial derivatives blow out -- carbon derivatives, or derivative carbon swaps, or something.

 

In his second life, after Vietnam, Robert McNamara went on to champion global warming and Sustainable Development. I like to say McNamara created Sustainable Forest Growth (think about it) in Vietnam with that agent orange project. The corporation-government man who orders spraying agent orange on tropical jungle goes on to become high level global environmental spokesman. The irony is spicey. And if that ain't enough, he wiped out the two seat Ford Thunderbird. :angry2:

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Thanks!

 

Yea - the Carbon Markets are a complete fraud. They really aren't selling anything of concrete value. It is just all hot air (literally!).

 

In fact, here the carbon markets have crashed completely. Anyone who has purchased carbon credits in the US are now holding worthless paper.

 

Guess who made millions selling carbon credits.....................

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Ok. I suppose you think those guys all work for free? How do you think scientific studies come about?

 

http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/images/stories/papers/originals/climate_money.pdf

 

"(yet again, I´m not taking about global warming)" oh no, of course not :rolleyes:

 

here's a clue - they're all the same scientists and funding sources. They figured out that the Global Warming scam wasn't going to work (something about no warming for the last 15 years.....), so they've been trying out lots of new labels for the same idiotic anti-energy/economy eco-fascist global regime. They've shopped for;

 

Global Warming

Climate Change

Climate Disruption

Bio-Diversity

Global Wierding (that one got them laughed off of even the sympathetic editorial pages)

Sustainability (several variations)

and now the latest is Sustainable Economic Development - but it is really just all about Global Economic Fascism/Socialism.

 

Peak Oil was also in there as a subset of Sustainability - but the Peak Production of oil is an artificial result of deliberate government suppression of oil development. This is one of those government efforts to shut down new oil production - and then point to the fact that oil production has peaked. No kidding.......

 

Your mass extinction fantasy was part of the bio-diversity scam which fell apart as scientists keep finding new species that they didn't know existed, and lots of living examples of supposedly extinct species still doing just fine.

 

The biggest problem with the Eco-Fascist crowd is that they are using predictions based on theoretical models which don't actually replicate the real world. Not suprisingly, the theoretical predictions don't actually come to pass. The mass exinction fiction is based on theoretical climate predictions which have failed 100%.

 

 

Well, I honestly didn’t want to come back to this thread, yet what you wrote, and more importantly, implied here crossed the line by far...

 

I´m not going to reply to your outrageous conspiracy nonsense (which is actually so ridiculous that it´s funny) but I may give you some personal insight:

I am a biologist and I work on biodiversity. So you can either stand up and tell me to my face that my PhD studies are all a fraud and that I´m a liar paid by some eco-fascists (or for that matter: the climate conspiracy or the economic socialists...you name it) or you can apologize to me for your defamatory statements. Your call...

Edited by ToS
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Srangely enough..it was the last part of the video I found the most moving!...all those nice people, murdered for protecting what needs protecting, from the greed of others

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Well, I honestly didn’t want to come back to this thread, yet what you wrote, and more importantly, implied here crossed the line by far...

 

I´m not going to reply to your outrageous conspiracy nonsense (which is actually so ridiculous that it´s funny) but I may give you some personal insight:

I am a biologist and I work on biodiversity. So you can either stand up and tell me to my face that my PhD studies are all a fraud and that I´m a liar paid by some eco-fascists (or for that matter: the climate conspiracy or the economic socialists...you name it) or you can apologize to me for your defamatory statements. Your call...

 

 

Thank you for posting.

 

Heck

 

 

 

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