JediMaster has one of the best lines about our hobby ever!

[+Dave]

 

Bottom line you can't fly the A-10C like the A-10A with LGBs. Why is it wrong to want that?

The casual fliers say "I don't care how hardcore you want it, go ahead, just let me fly my way" and the hardcore say "NO! It must be as REAL as possible, and no one should want less!"?? confused

 

That pretty much sums it up. Thoughts?

[jeanba]

I think that it also sums up the difficulties of the flight simulation market :

Back in the middle 90s (EAW, CFS1 or 2) a "simulation" was relatively simple.

Even SF2 would have been rated as "quite realistic" in those times.

Now, the simmers wants something very realsitic and casual players want to play with max difficulty because they are "real men" or "real woman" (if I believed in Santa klaus, I wopuld write "women") but at the same time, they find the realistic approach too "compilicated", so they went away.

[+Stratos]

Dave, can you link please the threat where JediMaster posted that? Thanks

 

And Yes, I agree with JediMaster here, FC3 level is perfect for me, or SF2 If TK would add A-G radar, NVG and A-A refuelling. Anyway I wanted a proper A-G radar for so long time that I will get F/A-18C and try to get a printed manual as well. Also have been thinking how DCS will be If SF2 modders move there.

[+Dave]

It was from a post over at SimHq.

 

http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4008957/DCS_-_I_don%27t_think_it%27s_what_#Post4008957

[+Stratos]

Ok, have benn following the threat and even posted there, but I missed that post.

[+Dave]

Its a great conversation. I can take either hard core or FC3 style. I like both. I am like some posted have said, you start to learn the other systems as well.

[paulrkiii]

I'm not a fan of FC3 level aircraft but all that means is I won't purchase them.  I have nothing against them being developed and sold I just prefer the challenge of DCS level airframes.

Edited September 16, 2014 by paulrkiii

[+MigBuster]

FC3 level seems good to me - still a bit to learn and gives an appreciation - and ED could push out new modules a lot easier and quicker. 

 

My only issue with hardcore is the time it takes to produce new avionics etc - I don't see it being totally viable considering the dwindling amount of people that will buy them.

 

That being said its great to have had the hardcore experience - it is bloody good.

[+Dave]

Well JM ht it on the head though, some people do not have time to dedicate to learning every damn switch and setting on the planet. ED needs to to consider this. They need to give simmer a choice of flying hardcore or not by making the planes scaleable. If they do that then no one is left out. Sales will increase too. 

[+Stratos]

Well JM ht it on the head though, some people do not have time to dedicate to learning every damn switch and setting on the planet. ED needs to to consider this. They need to give simmer a choice of flying hardcore or not by making the planes scaleable. If they do that then no one is left out. Sales will increase too. 

 

Agree 100%

[malibu43]

JM pretty much hits the nail on the head throughout the entire thread. But I have my own "favorite JM" quote from that thread. In response to letting sales figures dictate what ED should focus on.

 

"SHQ member - Why make a poll when they have sales figures?

 

JM - Really? They have sales figures of a FC3 style western multiform aircraft?"

 

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure the interest would explode should a FC3 level F-18 or F-16 be released. Or a FC3 AH-64 for that matter...

Edited September 16, 2014 by malibu43

[+Dave]

JM pretty much hits the nail on the head throughout the entire thread. But I have my own "favorite JM" quote from that thread. In response to letting sales figures dictate what ED should focus on.

 

"SHQ member - Why make a poll when they have sales figures?

 

JM - Really? They have sales figures of a FC3 style western multiform aircraft?"

 

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure the interest would explode should a FC3 level F-18 or F-16 be released. Or a FC3 AH-64 for that matter...

Stratos said that.  

[malibu43]

Stratos said that.

 

Damn. That's what I get for doing this from my phone...

 

Well said both Stratos and JM.

[+Stratos]

Yes, it was me. 

[+JediMaster]

What's funny is you would think an FC-level avionics implementation would be easier to make first. Then judging by response to it they could upgrade it to full-blown mode later on and the people like paulrkiii who didn't want that lower level could get it.

They have announced the intent to upgrade a couple of the FC3 planes to full systems modeling later, but not one of the full planes has been announced to get a reduced treatment. So they should start low and work it up.

 

I know the Hornet is supposed to be a couple of years off still, but couldn't they release an FC-level version a year earlier, with F-15C-type radar (albeit with ground mode added and all that other naval stuff) and then pump it up to the A-10C level of detail the following year for an upgrade price. In the interim year they'd be getting money from people enjoying the Hornet, and if they're doing the upgrade then maybe those like paulrkiii might buy it anyway just to try it then shelve it till the upgrade comes. Also, this might be a legit way for ED to make more on the planes that cost more to make.

 

I do acknowledge it will be a bit more work than JUST the full version alone, but I think the added sales would make up for it. Instead of selling it at $60, sell the FC3 version for $40. Then, a year or whenever later that the upgrade is ready, they charge $30 for that.

 

Let's face it, the hardcore fans will wait for a hardcore bird. The casual fans will not grab a hardcore bird on the hope that it will get easier later--because that's never happened. :(

Right now buying some of the DCS planes for me is like buying a super pricey Swiss army knife when all I wanted was a spoon--all those features they toiled to make I ignore and care nothing about, like some of the radio and navigation things.

 

After 6 years of flying the Ka-50 I NEVER use the autopilot. After 10 years of the Su-25T I never use the autopilot there either. It's too different from the other "typical" ones so I just fly hands-on the whole time rather than waste time figuring it out.

[paulrkiii]

That's the thought process VEAO is pursuing  FC3 level (with clickable cockpit) then DCS level.  Obviously the Hawk is a rather "simple" aircraft anyways so the only major difference that I can think of is the flight model.

 

I do agree though, if ED clearly stated something along the lines of

 

"For the F/A-18C we will initially release F/A-18C for DCS World.  This will include SFM with simplified avionics and non clickable cockpit.  We will continue to develop DCS F/A-18C, when completed it will include PFM (Professional Flight Model) and ASM (Advanced System Modeling).  Those that purchase F/A-18C for DCS World will be able to upgrade to DCS: F/A-18C for $XX.XX when released."

 

I honestly think most members of the community would be ok with this and understand it's a natural development cycle. 

[+Dave]

That is the exact way they should do it.