Which flight sim is better... Lomac or Falcon 4.0af?

[feldwebel 0]

I was just wondering... They both look great. Lock on: Modern Air Combat or Falcon 4.0 Allied force... what would you say?

Also I am looking for any modern type flight sim games that include air craft such as:

f-14,f-15,f-16,f-18,f-22,f-117, etc.

[Mladuna 0]

Well, Lock On has F-15, A-10, Su-27, Mig-29 (two versions) and, Su-25. Whit the expansion pack Flaming Cliffs you get the Su-25T. This sim has great graphic and is moderately complicated but has a static campaign (a number of preplanned missions).

Falcon 4 AF on the other hand has only one plane F-16 (post block 30 versions I think) But its graphics are from 90's and its the most complicated simulation available for the desktop computers (It come whit the 700 page manual and engine starting procedure in full real mod takes +10 minutes) but has a number of interesting dynamic campaigns (missions are generated according to situation development on the virtual battlefield).

 

Here some basic guidelines. I'm not gonna talk which I think is better. But if you are starting whit combat simulations Lock On may be a better choice. If you are a well trained simmer go for the ultimate challenge: Falcon 4 AF

Edited December 17, 2007 by Mladuna

[sparkomatic 7]

Falcon is a simulation, Lock On is a sim-game (since you can tweak so many features to be more game-like). But since now you can probably get both for like $10 why bother, get them both and find out which you like best.

 

Now if you can score an old copy of USNF97...now that is a sweet ride

[+Muesli 2,161]

Try Strike Fighters: Project One with a couple of downloaded panes and campaigns and all is well!

 

 

Muesli

[Dagger 21]

That depends on how deep you want to go, Falcon 4 is a hard core sim, I mean it has a very steep learning curve, if you want to learn all the systems. LOMAC is a sim-game, like was said earlier, not nearly as deep. Graphics in Lomac are much better, but if you get hi-tiles for Falcon, it is a very good looking sim. I have tried them both and I got rid of LOMAC, I still fly Falcon and have enjoyed it very much, I still do.

Another option that was mentioned is The Strike Fighters series, there's so many add-ons for it, and they are for the most part free, and the level of detail is amazing. If you want the more modern aircraft then by far the one to choose is Wings over Europe, theres a Wings over Vietnam, and Strike Fighters:Project 1, and if you are into WW1 then First Eagles is the newest offering from TK. For me the choice was easy...the mighty F-4, in all her glory!

I Don't know how much time you want to invest in learning, so I would suggest that you look at all the different options, also how much of a system you have is another thing to consider, LOMAC is very hardware intensive, Falcon isn't to bad, and the Thirdwire sims are much easier than Lomac, and the graphics can be tweaked to suit you on all of them.

[Guest Saganuay82]

Like pushing switches and doing it like for real - Falcon 4 <<<<<<<<< and I just got this one.

 

Like jumping into a plane and blowing stuff away and not worried if the radar is in the right config - Thirdwire series

 

Don't own LOMAC so can't comment but it looks nice and makes nice movies :)

[+DoctorQuest 125]

I will try to keep my comments objective and civil.

 

One big issue for me is that F4AF is being actively supported by the developer whereas LOMAC has been pretty much ignored by the developer since the release of Flaming Cliffs.

 

Other than that they are both good sims with different objectives in mind for gameplay. They are really way too different to compare head-to-head.

 

I agree with previous posts. For the price get both.

[+streakeagle 871]

Graphics

Falcon 4.0 has addons to enhance graphics, but anyone who has played modern games can see F4.0 is a generation behind.

Likewise, SFP1 series has limited detail for terrain compared to modern sims, but the aircraft/ground object details and textures are unbeatable.

LOMAC set a new standard that slowed down even the best hardware available when it was released and still drops framerates substantially with max quality settings in certain situations.

1) LOMAC

2) SFP1/WOV/WOE

3) Falcon 4.0

 

Difficulty/Realism (especially avionics)

Falcon 4.0 set a standard that has only been challenged by Jane's F/A-18.

LOMAC is done well, but lacks the clickable cockpit and dynamic campaigns.

SFP1 series is called a "sim-lite" by its own creator, but certain elements are actually capable of being more realistic than any sim currently available, but not out-of-the-box.

1) Falcon 4.0

2) LOMAC

3) SFP1/WOV/WOE

 

Gameplay

Falcon 4.0 is very scalable, toned down it is as easy to play as SFP1 series. Scaled up, it is the most challenging combat flight sim ever released (thought Jane's F/A-18 runs a close 2nd).

SFP1 is fun and can be very challenging, but the AI has its limitations which can destroy immersion and make the game too easy even on hardest stettings.

LOMAC isn't too much different than Falcon 4.0 or SFP1, but the environment seems more sterile and the modern avionics/weapons make air-to-air combat a boring stand-off BVR fight between missiles, radar, and ecm. If you can get in close for a good gunfight, it is fun. Air-to-ground operations are fairly detailed and interesting.

1) Falcon 4.0

2) SFP1/WOV/WOE

3) LOMAC

 

Multiplayer

LOMAC is so solid for online conectivity that it is used by the virtual Thunderbirds. The built-in ability to fly opposing sides provides a good environment for squad vs squad fights.

Falcon 4.0 is pretty good for online in its latest implementation (Allied Force), but leans toward co-op with its focus on flying F-16s.

SFP1 series simply does not provide enough multiplayer options to hold interest for most online players. Connectivity has its issues as well.

1) LOMAC

2) Falcon 4.0

3) SFP1/WOV/WOE

 

Variety

SFP1 series is king here: almost no limit to what you can fly or where you can fly. Number and quantity of addons is unbelievable and most are free.

LOMAC out-of-the-box isn't bad, but doesn't leave much room for addons beyond reskinning unless you enjoy flying aircraft that have the same cockpit/capability of a stock aircraft while using a different 3d model.

Falcon 4.0 has tons of addons and to a certain extent allows you to fly other aircraft, but clearly this sim is focused on flying Falcons and at this point those marketing Falcon 4 Allied Force don't want anyone distributing the kind of mods that kept Falcon 4 around for so long.

1) SFP1/WOV/WOE

2) LOMAC

3) Falcon 4.0

 

While I own all of these sims (and many more), the combination of limited time and personal preferences leave me playing primarily the SFP1 series and WOV in particular.

I like the historical flavor and much prefer flying F-4s, F-105s, F-8s, F-100s, A-4s, etc. I also prefer using older weapons that are unreliable and have limited release envelopes that require far more flying skills and tactics to hit both air and ground targets.

I have done full-blown ramp starts with Falcon 4.0. I think the level of detail is awesome. But I don't have the time to waste and I am bored by air combat dominated by the use of all-aspect heat-seekers (AIM-9L/M) and AMRAAM. For others, Falcon 4.0 is the ultimate in gameplay (hence my labeling it #1 above), but for me, I almost never play it.

I enjoy flying the F-15 in LOMAC, but I am not too excited by using AIM-9L/Ms and AMRAAMs nor by facing opponents equipped with the same or better weapons.

[feldwebel 0]

I bought both. I love both games but I have a question about falcon that I need answered... On campaign mode there seems to be certain times u need to reach each steerpoint and land. In fact on some missions it says to take off at 5:01 game time and land at like 5:51. Does that mean I have to fly for a full hour to complete that mission? Game time does seem to go by real minutes.

[Dagger 21]

I bought both. I love both games but I have a question about falcon that I need answered... On campaign mode there seems to be certain times u need to reach each steerpoint and land. In fact on some missions it says to take off at 5:01 game time and land at like 5:51. Does that mean I have to fly for a full hour to complete that mission? Game time does seem to go by real minutes.

Everything is real time, use the time acc. and enjoy the flight. it gives you a chance to work on your navigation and making sure you get to the target on time, your timing is very important in the campaign.

[feldwebel 0]

Timing acc? Is there a time accelerator? I'll have to check it out. Also when you are out of missiles and guns how does one continue a campaign? Or does that mean it's pretty much over?

Also what if I get to all the waypoints early. Can I land earlier or in order to complete the mission 100% do I need to wait til it's 5:59 or whatever to land?

[sparkomatic 7]

good point on F/A-18...the old F-15E by Janes was good as well, also very realistic if you like mudslinging

[JediMaster 451]

Timing acc? Is there a time accelerator? I'll have to check it out. Also when you are out of missiles and guns how does one continue a campaign? Or does that mean it's pretty much over?

Also what if I get to all the waypoints early. Can I land earlier or in order to complete the mission 100% do I need to wait til it's 5:59 or whatever to land?

 

It depends on the mission. Some like escort or CAP have time requirements such as 15 mins on station or escort until back in friendly territory or whatever. The "blow it up" missions generally don't have those and you can land when you want.

When you say "out of guns", do you mean your plane is out, or do you mean you've run your campaign supplies out of weapons? If the former, you can land and rearm if you need to to complete the mission. If you mean the latter, I guess you're done!

[Silverbolt 104]

FF4 Red Viper

[Dagger 21]

good point on F/A-18...the old F-15E by Janes was good as well, also very realistic if you like mudslinging

I actually reloaded this sim, and it is still a favorite of mine.

[DirtyBirdFA 1]

I only own F4AF out of the two, so I can only vouch for that particular game.

 

Graphics: Like others have pointed out, the graphics on this sim aren't exactly top-notch. The terrain looks fuzzy and hazy..almost a generic patch of green/brown/tan with a few mountains here and there. Damage detail on the jet is practically non-existant, with the exception of a weakly-done fire trail that sorta appears once your bird has taken a catastrophic hit. However, the in-cockpit details are pretty good, almost photo realistic, and all consoles are fully clickable.

 

Gameplay: The campaigns are what make this sim fun. You are given choice to participate in campaigns in the Balkans or in the Koreas, and there is also a Panama theater of operations available to download here in C.A. What set these campaigns apart from others is that the campaign adjusts to the human pilot's sucess or failures, which has consequences on the overall theater. For instance, if you fail to sweep an area clean of bogies over a target, the incoming SEAD package might be torn to shreds by the enemy CAP, and the following strike package might get shot outta the sky by the SAMS that should have been destroyed. Even while you are in the hangar messing with your weapons config or looking at the latest recon, AI generated missions are operating nonstop. And don't think you can finish a campaign in one day's sitting...these campaigns take days to finish!

 

Difficulty: This game can be scaled back to have an arcadish feel to it, but it was meant to be flown in full realism. The accompanying 700pg+ PDF manual doesn't seem enough to cover all the game is capable of, what each button is used for, or how to defeat certain threats. But as others have stated, in full realism you are responsible for knowing which avionic configuration works best for a particular mission, how to lock-on to bogies or static objects, and what settings your multi-functional displays work best to give you the information you need to stay alive. The individual enemy varies in difficulty: some you can just blast out of the sky, while some MiG 21s will give you a fight of a lifetime. FLAK and AAA placements are surprisingly accurate, and when sychronized with SAM installments, are darn right deadly! The full clickability of the cockpit and the effective enemy AI make every mission a pleasure to fly. Imagine looking into the tv display on the bottom right side of cockpit, trying to place the target designator box of the LGB over the nuclear reactor while at the same time making sure the knobs and switches, altitude, heading, and speed are correct when all of a sudden warning tones come to life screaming, indicating an imminent threat. You change your gaze up to the Threat Warning Scope in upper left corner of the cockpit to see the radar return of an SA-5 and the MISSILE LAUNCH WARNING display flashing. What do you do? Drop chaff hoping to spook the missile and keep on course until you can pickle the paveway? Or do you jettison stores and go into immediate evasive manuevers? If you can imagine that, that's F4AF.

Edited December 19, 2007 by DirtyBirdFA

[+DoctorQuest 125]

I have a win98 paritition with a Voodoo 3 card just so I can run JF-15 in all it's glory.

[Dagger 21]

DirtyBird that is a great description of the game play! I have been in that place before, as for the ground tiles, Hi-Tiles fixes that, they are one of the few add-ons i paid for and it was a super buy, I can change seasons,and the detail makes it a top notch game. be sure to check them out. Heres the link to them

HITILES

[feldwebel 0]

What set these campaigns apart from others is that the campaign adjusts to the human pilot's sucess or failures

So if you fail to shoot down a mig-21 or whatever threat, it is possible that he may shoot down a buddy later on in the campaign?

[sparkomatic 7]

I have a win98 paritition with a Voodoo 3 card just so I can run JF-15 in all it's glory.

 

 

now that is dedication!

[Dagger 21]

So if you fail to shoot down a mig-21 or whatever threat, it is possible that he may shoot down a buddy later on in the campaign?

yep, theres that chance, just like the real thing.

[Platinum Rogue 48]

So if you fail to shoot down a mig-21 or whatever threat, it is possible that he may shoot down a buddy later on in the campaign?

 

Not directly - The campaign isn't really affected by individual AI aircraft being present or not. F4 campaigns are statistical wars where your own ability to complete missions successfully, reduces the enemy's ability to hold on to ground. If you fail too many missions, or lose too many aircraft, the enemy has higher morale and increased supply, making winning the campaign easier for them.