SAR missions

[viperBAT32]

we sorely need some SAR missions for the series...i.e; some chinooks and jolly greens....along with some special forces insertion missions....anyone working on these? or is this a pipe dream for ol' viperBAT?

[snakeman]

Yes I agree would be a new slant !

[Lt. James Cater]

I've daydreamed a few times about what an SAR mission would be like in this sim. Historically speaking, a few huge battles developed betwen the USAF and North Vietnamese defenses during SAR operations. The Americans had a pilot down and the NVA knew the area and would reinforce the AAA to disrupt rescue operations. There were some multi day tasks that came about from the above situation.

[Stratos]

With the Afghan terrain around what about Hind ops? You know extraction/insertion missions, like the old good DI Hind

[viperBAT32]

With the Afghan terrain around what about Hind ops? You know extraction/insertion missions, like the old good DI Hind

exactly Stratos! the sim would explode into imersiveness!all angles would be covered and the exp. would be AWESOME! combat air support for cover while choppers insert troops or dust off's take out wounded from combat area under fire....the possibilities would be endless!

[viperBAT32]

I've daydreamed a few times about what an SAR mission would be like in this sim. Historically speaking, a few huge battles developed betwen the USAF and North Vietnamese defenses during SAR operations. The Americans had a pilot down and the NVA knew the area and would reinforce the AAA to disrupt rescue operations. There were some multi day tasks that came about from the above situation.

ala BAT21? think of the possibilities!

downed aircrew on the run....enemy closing in...jolly greens explode over canopy to rescue while skyraiders and huey gunships,cobras,fly aircover! makes me shiver!

[Lt. James Cater]

Somewhat like that.

 

The Hollywood BAT21 was somewhat of a sham. I have a book in my storage unit that has the real deal concerning that operation as well as other SARs during the period. I just wish i could remember the title.

 

Not only would it be very interesting from our sim perspective, but Linebacker and beyond would be very diffcult to pull off unscathed in certain areas.

Edited November 6, 2008 by Lt. James Cater

[viperBAT32]

Somewhat like that.

 

The Hollywood BAT21 was somewhat of a sham. I have a book in my storage unit that has the real deal concerning that operation as well as other SARs during the period. I just wish i could remember the title.

 

Not only would it be very interesting from our sim perspective, but Linebacker and beyond would be very diffcult to pull off unscathed in certain areas.

thats the lure of it for me...but,what if u DO pull it off? satisfaction...the thrill of it in simulation....wow i just pulled a pilot out of a hornets nest with an entire NVA battalion rolling in on us!!might be good angle for MP mission....hmmmmm..

[+Soulfreak]

it would be cool to rescue some civilians with some CH-53G out of a little african country, or a downed tornado crew in afghanistan. but i think it is not really possible (to pick a ground object up).

[Rambler 1-1]

could you not just make a mission where one of the waypoints is at 0 feet and 0 knots, and have a 2 minute loiter time? Then you could land behind enemy lines, although you would have to imagine picking up or dropping off stuff. Anything else would require a major change in the system, would it not?

[colmack]

YAP has done that but, you know you need to buy it....

[GwynO]

could you not just make a mission where one of the waypoints is at 0 feet and 0 knots, and have a 2 minute loiter time? Then you could land behind enemy lines, although you would have to imagine picking up or dropping off stuff. Anything else would require a major change in the system, would it not?

 

That's the closest I could think to do it to but that leaves out the search element, kind of dull just flying to the precise point even if there is a pilot figure or other such person to land on, what's the point, not like he can get on anyway, would still be there waving to you as you pull up and away. No idea how YAP did it, no more money spare till after Xmas.

Edited November 7, 2008 by Mab Glyndwr

[+ST0RM]

Before I became a Boom operator, I taught aircrew survival to our crews at Ramstein, and our NATO allies. Prior to that, I was assigned to two Spec ops helo squadrons and took part in both of the rescues over Kosovo. CSAR/Personnel Recovery is in my blood.

 

Anyhow, one of the coolest exercises I did was out at the Hohenfels training grounds. We had 2 HH-60G Pavehawks, 2 Mi-8s, 2 Mi-17s, and 2 Mi-24s. The rescue package differed everyday, but would consist of a pair of escorts and one extraction platform. Sometimes the Hinds would cover the Pavehawks and on others the Pavehawks would cover the Hip, while the Hind sanitized the area.

 

During 7 days of field exercises, we picked up 5 "downed" crewmen in all in various scenarios. Forest, urban and hilltops. On the final 2-day rescue, I teamed up with a German Tornado pilot. We successfully evaded capture that entire day and half the night. At midnight, we linked up with a French Pararescue team and we hiked to our pickup point, 20kms away. The next morning, we made radio contact with an AWACs who locked into our position, via GPS. After waiting a few more hours, the first words from the rescue birds came across the radio. We had a pair of SANDY F-16s overhead who would direct the show. The air component of the OPFOR were German F-4Fs and UH-1 Hueys. After a positive authentication of us, the Vipers directed other F-16CJs into the area to clear out the big threats, like a ZSU-23-4 we had spotted during our evasion the day prior, and told them about since it could become a problem. The "Weasel Vipers" dispatched the SAM/AAA threats and then flew cover. We got word the helos were inbound and prepared for our exfil. The Sandys dropped down and flew past our position on top of the hill, dipping a wing to us to show they know where we are and also to show the helos which side of the hilltop we were on. The Hinds roared over and hit some troop vehicles, and the few dismounted troops surrounding the hill. A quick pop of the smoke and a Hip dropped into the LZ to grab us. 2 minutes later we were airborne, headed home.

 

I could go on and into alot more detail, but I think you got the idea.

 

So yeah, some SAR missions would be great!

 

Jeff

[Stratos]

MMM. We can't load them but maybe we can destroy them?? I will explain and is only a wild idea ( or not? ) Give the infantry to be loaded a very weak hitpoint value, load the chopper with a very low explosive invisible bomb. Land near or over the troops and deploy the bomb so the troop dissapear. If we use the infantry as friendly, they will be attached by the enemy ( and that's cool and realistic ) but we will get the friendly fire message when we destroy them, If we use enemy infantry ( of course with no weapons ) the enemy will not attack them.

BTW is possible to add waypoints for land units?

[Stratos]

What about a very strong Harrier style VTOL ( sorry forget the name ) for chopper FM? You add more power, you fly higher, less power, lower

[Stratos]

No one interested? or maybe is not possible?

[Jug]

Before I became a Boom operator, I taught aircrew survival to our crews at Ramstein, and our NATO allies. Prior to that, I was assigned to two Spec ops helo squadrons and took part in both of the rescues over Kosovo. CSAR/Personnel Recovery is in my blood.

 

Anyhow, one of the coolest exercises I did was out at the Hohenfels training grounds. We had 2 HH-60G Pavehawks, 2 Mi-8s, 2 Mi-17s, and 2 Mi-24s. The rescue package differed everyday, but would consist of a pair of escorts and one extraction platform. Sometimes the Hinds would cover the Pavehawks and on others the Pavehawks would cover the Hip, while the Hind sanitized the area.

 

During 7 days of field exercises, we picked up 5 "downed" crewmen in all in various scenarios. Forest, urban and hilltops. On the final 2-day rescue, I teamed up with a German Tornado pilot. We successfully evaded capture that entire day and half the night. At midnight, we linked up with a French Pararescue team and we hiked to our pickup point, 20kms away. The next morning, we made radio contact with an AWACs who locked into our position, via GPS. After waiting a few more hours, the first words from the rescue birds came across the radio. We had a pair of SANDY F-16s overhead who would direct the show. The air component of the OPFOR were German F-4Fs and UH-1 Hueys. After a positive authentication of us, the Vipers directed other F-16CJs into the area to clear out the big threats, like a ZSU-23-4 we had spotted during our evasion the day prior, and told them about since it could become a problem. The "Weasel Vipers" dispatched the SAM/AAA threats and then flew cover. We got word the helos were inbound and prepared for our exfil. The Sandys dropped down and flew past our position on top of the hill, dipping a wing to us to show they know where we are and also to show the helos which side of the hilltop we were on. The Hinds roared over and hit some troop vehicles, and the few dismounted troops surrounding the hill. A quick pop of the smoke and a Hip dropped into the LZ to grab us. 2 minutes later we were airborne, headed home.

 

I could go on and into alot more detail, but I think you got the idea.

 

So yeah, some SAR missions would be great!

 

Jeff

Love to hear the whole story. Wouldn't it be interesting to present a scenario in this SIM where air superiority is not yet established? Did your scenario include bad guy air assets? In Vietnam, Iraq and other places, US SAR forces did not have to deal with enemy aircraft. The ground defense ambushes were/are plenty exciting enough, but combat losses and SAR requirements are not limited to air superiority scenarios. You could almost make a mini-campaign out of one SAR attempt.

Edited November 8, 2008 by Jug

[WDH]

I would recommend thinking along these lines.

 

Pilot=enemy

SAR smoke from pilot=enemy weapon (AAA)

 

Pilot shoots SAR plane with SAR smoke, SAR plane sights smoke and conducts rescue.

 

Pilot to disappear=invisible SAR gun to "destroy pilot"

 

Pilot go poof, SAR bird lifts off.

 

By saganuay82 back in march '08

[Stratos]

Ein what? Can't understand this sistem. Can someone please explain it?

[WDH]

Ein what? Can't understand this sistem. Can someone please explain it?

 

Part of what you would need to start a mission build for SAR mission.Along with what terrain,aircraft,coordinates,adding groundobjects and other "fun stuff" you need to know.Very detailed to pull off a SAR mission.

[+Gepard]

SAR or better CSAR would be a nice feature. Perhaps we should ask TK. Normaly he is listening to the community.

I would also like to see escord missions where helis escorting a column of trucks or APC to defend them against enemy ground objects (Taliban for instance)

[WDH]

SAR or better CSAR would be a nice feature. Perhaps we should ask TK. Normally he is listening to the community.

I would also like to see escort missions where Helios escorting a column of trucks or APC to defend them against enemy ground objects (Taliban for instance)

 

Now that's something I can sink some Hellfires in!Think the Helios are ready to be a realistic asset to this sim.Afghanistan with an Historical Russian Campaign would sell like hotcakes in my opinion.Not to mention,delivering some well placed ordinances,SOPS and supplies from NATO choppers to turn this into a modern day conflict of interest indeed.Desert Shield-Storm '90-'91 would be a good challenge too.Today's affairs in the middle east is littered with all kinds of choppers for all kinds of duty.Panama invasion would be another to consider.After all,we wasn't just there to capture ole' Pineapple face,we were there to suppress cartel and to maintain "ownership" of Panama Canal,Black Ops/DEA.The Air Cav needs to be represented in Vietnam to most current of events.Israel without the chopper is like the Colorado without Aspen!Falkland War?This not a rant,this is an out loud thought of what could be.

I'm cool with every sim TK has brought down the pike but,"WE'RE" ready for a TK Helio sim also.

 

Sorry,viperBAT32 (my brother) didn't mean to hijack your thread.

Edited November 9, 2008 by WDH

[viperBAT32]

hey no prob bro! see what kind of excitement this can stir?somebody will do this....eventually.if this happens,the electric companies will have to allocate resources to us because we all are playing it 24-7!!!!this can happen....someone with the goods will just have to dedicate themselves to it!

[Lt. James Cater]

thats the lure of it for me...but,what if u DO pull it off? satisfaction...the thrill of it in simulation....wow i just pulled a pilot out of a hornets nest with an entire NVA battalion rolling in on us!!might be good angle for MP mission....hmmmmm..

 

Imagine something along the lines of having to reduce the AAA in a certain area under a time limit. Make the flak MASSIVLY dense and it should be be a decent simulation of reality.

 

With Jaegers' mod on the flak settings, things should be very...Fascinating!

[Lt. James Cater]

Love to hear the whole story. Wouldn't it be interesting to present a scenario in this SIM where air superiority is not yet established? Did your scenario include bad guy air assets? In Vietnam, Iraq and other places, US SAR forces did not have to deal with enemy aircraft. The ground defense ambushes were/are plenty exciting enough, but combat losses and SAR requirements are not limited to air superiority scenarios. You could almost make a mini-campaign out of one SAR attempt.

 

In Vietnam that was true to a certain exent but,

 

a few pickups had to be aborted due to the proximity of enemy aircraft and in 1970, an HH-53B call sign JOLLY GREEN 71 was shot down by a Mig 21 while trying to get to a WW crew north of the Mu Gia pass with the loss of all crew. The crew of the F-105F, call sign SEABIRD 02, were declared MIA.