Over Flanders Fields: Between Heaven and Hell Phase 3 is now available!

[ArgonV 2]

You can order it on DVD only at the moment from their website here: http://www.overflandersfields.com/

 

I cannot wait to get this!!

[HotNess 2]

that looks coooool.

 

 

xx v xx

[+Stary 2,426]

Right now I'm enjoying my copy of FE Gold but maybe in future...? There's a little thing about OFF that I don't like much and it's called CFS3 engine*

 

But Phase One and especiallyTwo were very enjoyable not to mention enormous work put into the phases by the team!

 

 

*Ok, Mediterran Air War, OFF 1&2 and recent ETO Expansion changed CFS3... there are just few issues I can't stand about it

 

 

Edit: 50 bucks... not so cheap

Edited January 14, 2009 by CA_Stary

[+DoctorQuest 108]

Agreed. OFF1 was ok but I let it go when FE came out. I know these guys work their butts off on this stuff but $50 is $50 and YAP2 will be out soon (I hope). I need to watch my simming dollars these days.

 

I will at least wait for a review.

Edited January 14, 2009 by kirbykern

[godzilla1985 0]

I think I'll be waiting for an un-biased review also. I did have OFF2 on my rig but had to do a reinstall and was never able to get it to install again, no matter what I tried. FE is for XP but it runs great on my Vista OS (all my TW games do), also the mods are easy to install and all work great, so until I see what the jury says about any install issues with Vista I will be waiting in the wings. Even if I do get OFF3, FE will still get lots more of my playing time as I really like the fact that you can fly any mission type, in anytime of day or weather and you can get a couple of missions in even if you don't have allot of free time. I don't know if this will be the case for OFF3, as I'm not sure if it has quick missions or if the time skip problems of OFF2 have been overcome. Another game feature that OFF3 has that I do think is awsome but also causes me some worry is the weather in the game. I do think it's awsome that OFF3 features historically accurate weather for the day your flying in but in all the video's I have seen it's either raining or overcast. Is the weather in Europe always that bad?

[JediMaster 451]

I DL'd phase 2, but I don't remember if I installed it...

I played some of phase 1, but really not much at all. I played a lot more CFS3 w/Firepower and 1% planes by a factor of like 50.

With FE/expansion/mods, I find I really don't ever think of playing OFF.

That makes $50 a waste for me, although for people that love WWI sims I think it isn't a bad deal.

[ArgonV 2]

I've ordered my copy. Phase 1 and Phase 2 were well worth the price (FREE) and Phase 3 is no doubt a production style effort. For that much past entertainment and enjoyment for free they've earned my dollar. :)

[godzilla1985 0]

As long as there is no install issues with Vista I will get OFF3 no doubt. I will support any simulator game developer as long as I don't have to go crazy getting it to run on my OS. I recently got out of building plastic model kits because the cost of the hobby got to lopsided compared to the enjoyment value. With model kits averaging $40-$50 for mid-range kits and over $100.00 for a top end kit which will occupy about a month or two of your time then collect dust, $50.00 for a good simulator is way more bang for the buck.

[Bandy 3]

Supposedly, the devs have got OFF3 easily installed and running well on every config. they threw at it (everything but XP 64bit, but that ain't surprising). Plus now that you pay for it, they are supporting it. I've bought it, and eagerly await arrival. $50 is not much compared to the price of dinner at an acceptable restaurant, considering the years of enjoyment it will give me. Plus these guys gave so much away leading up to it. I like to support good will.

 

I gave OFF2 a chance the last few months, and initially didn't like the FM's (just too much drag) coming from FE, but the more I flew in the game and enjoyed the campaign structure, the more I liked the fact that the planes were harder to fly overall.

 

The OFF birds don't roll as well, weaker rudder response, didn't climb as easily, etc. compared to FE. I've actually started to beleive OFF FM's are more true to the era, but who knows, I've never been in one in the real world so I defer to the more experienced. It is a matter of taste...

 

Just my opinion here, but I think TK & FE, and many/most of the players who are true to past 3rdWire games, are used to jet sims and planes that fly predictably like modern planes, and that's more what they want their WWI a/c to fly like for game play. I could be entirely wrong...

[Gr.Viper 131]

*still waits for RoF beta*

[Gremlin_WoH 0]

Make sure to read the interview with the OFF Development Team I have conducted in anticipation of the release.

 

Only on

 

Wings Of Honor

 

 

By the way did anyone watch the new Release Movie #11 ?

 

Cheers

Edited January 16, 2009 by Gremlin_WoH

[godzilla1985 0]

Thats a very good thing to hear that it will run on Vista and I will support developers who are making good stable simulators. But there is one thing that I don't quite understand. I keep hearing here and on other boards how we should support the OBD team by buying OFF:BHaH because of OFF1 & 2 being free, some of these guys make it sound like that in itself is unique and never done before. The great modders here and elsewhere have been doing this for years with TK's simulators. I have 3 different installs of Strike Fighters, one I kept original, the other is the Korean War mod and the other is the BoB mod (also Aircraft, terrains,effects fm etc). I mean TK did give us a good base that was Strike Fighters to start from and is very active in helping expanding on his product. It is because of this that I have continued supporting TK by purchasing FE, WOE & WOE (and others as soon as budget allows). Now OFF 1,2 and yes even OFF:BHaH on the other hand is based off of someone else game, not one of the OBD team's own design. So to me in the purest sense OFF 1, 2 & OFF:BHaH are mods because they are not stand alone games, you still need CFS3, a game not developed by OBD and that fact is undisputable. Now before you guys call in an airstrike on me please let me say this. Do I personally feel any mod is worth $50.00? In OFF:BHaH case, from what I have seen and read I would say yes, definitely. Unlike OFF 1 & 2 OFF:BHaH is a mod taken to a very very unique extreme in the sense it's almost a totally new game, not just an average or above average WW1 mod for CFS3. To me it's just odd to keep say "buy OFF:BHaH because OBD gave OFF 1 & 2 away for nothing". OFF:BHaH looks like it will sell itself on what it offers the WW1 simmer and thats a very good thing. Because in my case, if I based my decision to buy OFF:BHaH only off my experiance with OFF 2 (free or not) I wouldn't touch OFF:BHaH with a ten foot pole.

Edited January 16, 2009 by godzilla1985

[+Stary 2,426]

Couldn't agree more godzilla1985

[dsawan 615]

one question 59 bucks is kinda steep for me. Will the digital dwld be a little cheaper?

[Bandy 3]

...it's just odd to keep say "buy OFF:BHaH because OBD gave OFF 1 & 2 away for nothing".

 

Oops, didn't mean to imply that, and a good point to make if that is what is happening elsewhere on other forums.

 

I agree, OFF3 should sell based on its own merits. However, I do support honest work, good will, and the underdog. I have bought all of TK's sims, even though I rarely play modern air combat. I give thanks that perhaps I'm lucky to have the means to support good work, and even better when I can pay directly to the people that have sweat so much in creating it. Cutting out the middle man is sweet for me.

 

Just meant that OFF group HAVE generated a strong community of loyal players BASED on giving away their previous efforts.

My understanding is that, in the beginning at least, there was no idea to use this as a promotion for a payware mod, but best to ask them directly if you disagree.

 

In the end, it isn't any different than the controversial YAP business model, except perhaps you get more than missions and accessories, and if I remember correctly for a bit less than their whole package...

 

Does it fly in the face of the ethos of intellectual property sharing that goes on in so many forums? Perhaps so, and if it bugs people that much, then they have the choice to simply not support it.

Edited January 17, 2009 by B Bandy RFC

[Gr.Viper 131]

I'm more concerned with chances of a DVD getting intact (if at all) through Russian mail. Even some European music labels say that the only way get a CD to a client round here is via couriers.

[godzilla1985 0]

I'm more concerned with chances of a DVD getting intact (if at all) through Russian mail. Even some European music labels say that the only way get a CD to a client round here is via couriers.

Well I did see over at the OFF forum today someone from GamersGate or GoGamer(?) offered to make available electronic downloads for OFF:BHaH. Will have to see if the OBD takes em up on the offer, if your okay with electronic downloads. I have purchased two electronic downloads, FE and Steel Fury. You just have to make sure you hang on to purchase info in case of HD crash and you need to reinstall.

Edited January 17, 2009 by godzilla1985

[godzilla1985 0]

Oops, didn't mean to imply that, and a good point to make if that is what is happening elsewhere on other forums.

 

I agree, OFF3 should sell based on its own merits. However, I do support honest work, good will, and the underdog. I have bought all of TK's sims, even though I rarely play modern air combat. I give thanks that perhaps I'm lucky to have the means to support good work, and even better when I can pay directly to the people that have sweat so much in creating it. Cutting out the middle man is sweet for me.

 

Just meant that OFF group HAVE generated a strong community of loyal players BASED on giving away their previous efforts.

My understanding is that, in the beginning at least, there was no idea to use this as a promotion for a payware mod, but best to ask them directly if you disagree.

 

In the end, it isn't any different than the controversial YAP business model, except perhaps you get more than missions and accessories, and if I remember correctly for a bit less than their whole package...

 

Does it fly in the face of the ethos of intellectual property sharing that goes on in so many forums? Perhaps so, and if it bugs people that much, then they have the choice to simply not support it.

 

Interesting post B Bandy RFC and you do bring up a good point about YAP, but I will admit I'm way behind the curve when it comes down too did Microsoft or Thirdwire give their blessings for these pay mods. My post was all about the "you should buy because" theme only because to me it's a poor selling point for someone who has no clue what OFF 1 or 2 was, and for those who did play OFF 1 or 2 and had install issues, poor game play or were just not impressed. It's not the people who liked OFF1 & 2 OBD who need convince to buy OFF:BHaH, it's all the other people who have to be convince. If OFF:BHaH lives up to it's billing, OFF 1 & 2 will fast fade into a distant memory and that maybe a good thing if you know what I mean. But I have to ask why do you feel OFF:BHaH is the underdog? Do you mean because OFF:BHaH is in competiton against FE or RoF or because a small group of guys got together and pooled their talents to make what looks like the ultimate study sim of WWI, there by tweeking the nose of the big time developers and publishing houses?

[Bandy 3]

... But I have to ask why do you feel OFF:BHaH is the underdog? Do you mean because OFF:BHaH is in competiton against FE or RoF or because a small group of guys got together and pooled their talents to make what looks like the ultimate study sim of WWI, there by tweeking the nose of the big time developers and publishing houses?

 

Its the guys with day jobs and families, finding time to mod something because they just love it. I get that sense from lurking over at their forum. If they can see some of that invested time come back as some cash, then I'm all for it as long as it is a good game (better be good for $59 ). Most things corporate loose their spirit along the production line; good ideas get watered down or cut completely by bean counting execs. Middle men are a necessary evil sometimes if you want to reach more people; it's higher prices to consumers though until you hit a tipping point. WWI sims (and flight sims in genral) I think don't have enough broad consumer interest to reach a tipping point where the price will come down. That's why web publishing and self distribution evens the field somewhat with big houses, unless you've got close to 20 GB to push in OFF3...

 

However, once that dream starts to pay, then it becomes a job like anything else with all the headaches, and over at Sim-OH, you can see how much wingeing they've been putting up with now

 

Whoa, way off topic and on a soapbox. Better cut myself off at 2 double IPA's next time I get on the forums... Come to think of it, should put my money where my mouth is. I need to make my user donation to CA, I completely forgot with RL getting in the way.

[JediMaster 451]

Yes, that's another thing. When it's free, you can just say "stop whining, it's free" as long as it doesn't trash people's PCs. As soon as you charge for it you have to deal with support because people want something that works PERFECT for their cash.

[godzilla1985 0]

Yes, that's another thing. When it's free, you can just say "stop whining, it's free" as long as it doesn't trash people's PCs. As soon as you charge for it you have to deal with support because people want something that works PERFECT for their cash.

Wow thats true, that's an aspect I didn't think about . The tale of the tape will be soon once more people start getting their game DVD's I guess.

[+DoctorQuest 108]

The other thing that trips payware folks up is that the market DOES NOT CARE A WHIT what it cost you to create the product. If someone complains about the cost it will do you no good to talk about how many hours you put in, etc., etc.

 

You are entering a whole new world when you start charging for the product. You are no longer doing the community a favor. You are asking the community to shell out their hard earned dollars for what is effectively a luxury. Luxuries are the first thing to go when the economy goes south.

 

That is exactly my case. I have very few simming dollars to spend these days and while OFF3 may have cost these guys hours and hours of work I can't afford to care. I am on the fence right now with YAP2. I had to pass on SF2.

[+Stary 2,426]

I think Jedi Master hit the nail in the head. The thing that matters is that they (the team) doesn't seem to have the source code (it's Microsoft's intelectual property) so please remember there propably won't be any real patches or fixes to this product.

 

And please forget about Phase One and Two right now - these were freely available, comprehensive mods to CFS3 by Microsoft. It's fully-priced software product we're dealing with now.

 

Do not think I negate their work. It's been five years after all. And it's fine. But I don't like some attitude seen mostly on SimHQ forums. It's not the Holy Grail of flight simulators.

 

But it's just my, usually twisted, point of view.

[catch 81]

Supposedly, the devs have got OFF3 easily installed and running well on every config. they threw at it (everything but XP 64bit, but that ain't surprising). Plus now that you pay for it, they are supporting it. I've bought it, and eagerly await arrival. $50 is not much compared to the price of dinner at an acceptable restaurant, considering the years of enjoyment it will give me. Plus these guys gave so much away leading up to it. I like to support good will.

 

I gave OFF2 a chance the last few months, and initially didn't like the FM's (just too much drag) coming from FE, but the more I flew in the game and enjoyed the campaign structure, the more I liked the fact that the planes were harder to fly overall.

 

The OFF birds don't roll as well, weaker rudder response, didn't climb as easily, etc. compared to FE. I've actually started to beleive OFF FM's are more true to the era, but who knows, I've never been in one in the real world so I defer to the more experienced. It is a matter of taste...

 

Just my opinion here, but I think TK & FE, and many/most of the players who are true to past 3rdWire games, are used to jet sims and planes that fly predictably like modern planes, and that's more what they want their WWI a/c to fly like for game play. I could be entirely wrong...

 

No I think you're entirely right Bandy. But then I'm one of those horrible biased OFF guys. So I'll be hung, drawn and quartered here no doubt. But I look forward to it. It will be highly amusing.

 

Gotta laugh at some of the other comments. Pure misinformed speculation. Obviously nothing will change their minds. The ones that purchase it will be the winners. 50 bucks too expensive ! God give me strength.

[FastCargo 412]

Catch,

 

You're coming off as an arrogant ass.

 

Who gave you power to decide if 50 dollars is considered reasonable value or not?

 

Value of an object (whatever it is) is different for every individual person. One person may find that P3 is a great value for the money and have no problem buying it.

 

Another may not...for any number of reasons, of which several may have nothing to do with the actual quality of the product (lack of surplus funds, insufficient interest in the topic, etc).

 

Some will get the product immediately, some will wait until it's been out a while and get a feel of the pros and cons to see if the balance weighs toward purchase or not.

 

However, raining pure derision on a person for no other reason than the fact they express reservations based on their experiences with the previous releases smacks of elitism.

 

You want to convince folks to purchase? Stop acting like people who haven't purchased are somehow less deserving of respect. Answer questions or point them in the right direction to get their questions answered. Address mistaken speculation....you said it yourself, if the speculation is wrong, then correct it, with specific answers.

 

Now, on the other hand, this doesn't mean 50 dollars is somehow too much to charge. That is something the OFF team has to decide on their own. We as customers can either live with it or not purchase. You folks looking at buying can darn well bet the OFF team put some serious skull sweat into making that decision (considering how much effort they've put into the product). Do not automatically write it off just because of previous experiences based on a freeware mod. Don't dismiss a product out of hand...give it a while to see what the reactions are. Watch the hype and the bashing...the truth is somewhere in the middle.

 

Myself, I'm hoping for the best...I found myself intrigued with Phases 1 and 2.

 

FC