I Love MiG-17s

[Fubar512 1,350]

Served extra crispy

Crispy_Mig.wmv

[+Dave 2,322]

That a good place for Mig-17's too, getting raked by 20mm cannon fire.

[Fubar512 1,350]

That a good place for Mig-17's too, getting raked by 20mm cannon fire.

 

Yes, that's one Vulcan that you'll never hear wishing one to "Live long and prosper..."

[Stingray72 6]

I would call that a gun kill. There is NO WAY that guy made it lol, I mean, every single one of those bullets hit aluminum.

 

Does anyone know who's footage that is?

 

~Taxman

[Fubar512 1,350]

I would call that a gun kill. There is NO WAY that guy made it lol, I mean, every single one of those bullets hit aluminum.

 

Does anyone know who's footage that is?

 

~Taxman

 

AFAIK, that was gun camera footage from a Thud. Whover it was, he hosed that Fresco from end to end, and seems to have gotten most of that burst on target.

[UnknownPilot 33]

Extra crispy with lead stuffing, eh? Indeed, the best way for any commie to be. (though I must confess to liking the way many MiGs look.... )

[+Crusader 2,101]

"There's no kill like a guns kill" - Joe "Hoser" Satrapa, USN

 

[Canadair 16]

No Gun Kill like a Gun Kill, defintely.. Man and machine VS Man and machine, flying skills and technology,, the ultimate duel in the blue yonder.

While we are all passionate and fascinated by air war , or otherwise we would not be here, it could be reminded that the "extra cripsy" served mig had a living soul inside.

And wheter it was a commie, an american,an arab , or isreali, or whatever,, a gun kill video (or any kill for the matter) means that in the evenign the video was shot,, someone,,parents, a wife, a girlfriend, just friends,has been crying, mourning the loved one's loss.

the best place for 20mm bullets to be is in our games and in history books.

[+Dave 2,322]

And that living soul was the enemy. So too bad for him. I have no sympathy for the enemy at all. I can care less about their family etc. If they tables were turned he would of tried to kill me. So please don't try to put a moral spin on it all. We all know war is bad but I'm not about to get all wishy washy about it. This was a good gun kill.

[Canadair 16]

..an awesome gun Kill...

 

And that living soul was the enemy. So too bad for him. If they tables were turned he would of tried to kill me.

 

And often they do try to kill you, which believe it or not I DON'T like. I don't like my friends or allies or loved ones killed, so I assume the "enemy" doesn't like his friends to be killed either...

I have many friends in the military, pilots and other services. As you do Dave..your wife,,isn't she Army? And you yourself.., or FC, or Jug, or Typhoid, just to name a few who serve or served and attend this forum. I don't want to see any of them, ever, on the bad side of a video like this, that's all. And assuming "they" (whoever the enemy) is, ever get to them.

Anyway we had this conversation and I know where you stand..

 

 

. We all know war is bad

 

..and it is good to be reminded every now and then..

Edited January 24, 2010 by Canadair

[UnknownPilot 33]

While we are all passionate and fascinated by air war , or otherwise we would not be here, it could be reminded that the "extra cripsy" served mig had a living soul inside.

And wheter it was a commie, an american,an arab , or isreali, or whatever,, a gun kill video (or any kill for the matter) means that in the evenign the video was shot,, someone,,parents, a wife, a girlfriend, just friends,has been crying, mourning the loved one's loss.

the best place for 20mm bullets to be is in our games and in history books.

 

 

Oh good lord.

 

To paraphrase USAFMTL, the only good enemy is a dead enemy. Further, the only good commie is a dead commie. Eff him. He was on the wrong side, doing the wrong thing, and would have killed you in a heartbeat.

 

We really don't need all the heart bleeding here.

 

 

 

[macelena 1,070]

Agree with you, Canadair. It´s justified, but that won´t change that an enemy, that is, a guy who comes to fight and faces sacrifice. The fact that in turn he would kill you does just make him have more things in common with you than those who are out of the suck, if you are to engage and kill him. Personally i find the enemy a subject worth of respect in most cases, if not a criminal, and a loss. However, that shouldn´t prevent the job from being done

Edited January 24, 2010 by macelena

[UnknownPilot 33]

USAFMTL, regarding war being bad, you reminded me of something (something I know you know, and I'm not arguing with you or taking a shot, just keying off your comment )

 

 

[+Brain32 265]

In most gun kill pilot accounts I've read, they have seen the enemy punching out actually, now getting AIM-54 strait in the nose does not leave that possibility methinks...

[+streakeagle 871]

The successes of the F-105 against the MiG-17 is what helped seal the deal to make the gun armed F-4E. The F-105 was far less maneuverable than the F-4 and its pilots were only tasked and trained for strike missions, yet it was getting a good number of kills. After adding the gun, quite a few more MiGs were killed by F-4s than there would have been if no gun or gun pod was ever carried. I wonder how many opportunities the Navy missed because they almost never carried guns in Vietnam? Of course, the majority of kills were still scored with missiles, but the threat of the gun makes the enemy a little more cautious, especially with head-on passes.

[+Dave 2,322]

The successes of the F-105 against the MiG-17 is what helped seal the deal to make the gun armed F-4E. The F-105 was far less maneuverable than the F-4 and its pilots were only tasked and trained for strike missions, yet it was getting a good number of kills. After adding the gun, quite a few more MiGs were killed by F-4s than there would have been if no gun or gun pod was ever carried. I wonder how many opportunities the Navy missed because they almost never carried guns in Vietnam? Of course, the majority of kills were still scored with missiles, but the threat of the gun makes the enemy a little more cautious, especially with head-on passes.

 

Right on SE. I have also wondered how many kills the Navy missed because of not having a gun. I am sure many a fighter pilot will tell you that knowing they had a gun just in case made them feel alot better. I wonder how many F-4E drivers were out of missiles but got back in the fray to save someone knowing the gun was there. This is why we will always have a gun on our planes or have the ability to carry a gunpod worthy of A2A engaging.

[+Dave 2,322]

..and it is good to be reminded every now and then..

 

I don't need to be reminded, I am part of it everyday. I may not be a trigger puller however my missios gets those guys they equipment they need to do that mission. Or when I was in AWAC's and they forward deployed in Iraq and Afghanistan getting the ground the guys the airstrikes and CAS they needed. Even though my mission in the USAF is to fly fight and win, the guys on the ground are the most important and those guys are my heroes.

 

Anyway we all simulate this stuff and this is good footage of something we are interested about. Lets not rip it to pieces because of the moral implications. Its a f***ing good gun kill.

 

UP

 

That is a classic sign I love it.

[KJakker 901]

That is an impreseve video. It looks like the cannon stream was walked it across the fualage from left nose to right wing root and then the aircraft looks to me like it is starting to pitch down posably out of control. Wish the footage lasted two seconds longer to see if there was any secondary effects. In the last frame it seem there is a hint of somthing streaming from the fusalage. I would say that it is posable that the piolot was killed given the path of the shell hits.

[Fubar512 1,350]

In all probability, the footage ended when the MiG moved out of the camera's field of view. However, I did once see an interview with a noted film producer, who stated that some of the aerial footage taken during WWII, the Korean, and Vietnam wars, required editing, as it often contained some rather "distasteful" scenes.

Edited January 24, 2010 by Fubar512

[Fubar512 1,350]

No Gun Kill like a Gun Kill, defintely.. Man and machine VS Man and machine, flying skills and technology,, the ultimate duel in the blue yonder.

While we are all passionate and fascinated by air war , or otherwise we would not be here, it could be reminded that the "extra cripsy" served mig had a living soul inside.

And wheter it was a commie, an american,an arab , or isreali, or whatever,, a gun kill video (or any kill for the matter) means that in the evenign the video was shot,, someone,,parents, a wife, a girlfriend, just friends,has been crying, mourning the loved one's loss.

the best place for 20mm bullets to be is in our games and in history books.

 

"The duty of the fighter pilot is to patrol his area of the sky, and shoot down any enemy fighters in that area. Anything else is rubbish."

— Baron Manfred von Richthofen

Edited January 24, 2010 by Fubar512

[+Brain32 265]

In all probability, the footage ended when the MiG moved out of the camera's field of view. However, I did once see an interview with a noted film producer, who stated that some of the aerial footage taken during WWII, the Korean, and Vietnam wars, required editing, as it often contained some rather "distasteful" scenes.

 

I saw a few ww2 ones, real, really ugly. Low alt bailouts and messy bailout attempts, brrr

[Caesar 305]

The successes of the F-105 against the MiG-17 is what helped seal the deal to make the gun armed F-4E. The F-105 was far less maneuverable than the F-4 and its pilots were only tasked and trained for strike missions, yet it was getting a good number of kills. After adding the gun, quite a few more MiGs were killed by F-4s than there would have been if no gun or gun pod was ever carried. I wonder how many opportunities the Navy missed because they almost never carried guns in Vietnam? Of course, the majority of kills were still scored with missiles, but the threat of the gun makes the enemy a little more cautious, especially with head-on passes.

 

I should think several, and they knew it. I recall reading an account (then) Commander Paul "Gator" Gilchrist realted, while (then) Col. Robin Olds was going over gun camera footage for a committee on air combat (for which Gilchrist was in attendance), a MiG crossed an F-4's nose, with the F-4 unable to make an attack because of its lack of a gun. Gilchrist, an F-8 pilot said something to the effect of "right here is where I'd saw him in half with my Crusader's guns." Gilchrist noted that Olds paused for about 5 seconds so that other members could take that in [ref: "TOMCAT! The Grumman F-14 Story"]. Still not sure why the Navy never installed a gun into the F-4J, or other later models.