Return of the Falklands

[dsawan 624]

falklands Part 2?

 

http://www.thisiswesternmorningnews.co.uk/news/DEFEND-FALKLANDS/article-1849438-detail/article.html

[macelena 1,070]

I don´t speak for the Argentinian members, but i think that if the resolution to defend the islands is lean in the UK, the probability to take it by the arms by Argentina is even minor. They have other things to take care of

[jayo 0]

I loved the readers' comments at the end of that news story,read like a script from a house of commons session!!

[Slartibartfast 153]

Also the other thing that everyone forgets is the Islanders themselves who are proudly British I spent 4 months there in 1997 and talked to some of the people there and they are British as far as they are concerned.

 

It always comes down to Argentina and Britain for once why dont we listen to what the Islanders who live there want ?

 

If there was no oil/gas there would be no issue behind it... I could go on for days on this but I wont

[Silverbolt 104]

No way, Argentina ATM is quite craked.

IMO UK just want the Falklands for the same way that Argentina today.

i must remind that in 1982 Argentina was under a dictatorial government, and they were falling, so ...to get popular support they started th war.

today, UK wants a base to get in their Antarctica territory, and with the UN convention of sea....UK has an 200nm range , so they can reach the british antarctic territory.

If i remember correctly, the UN

 

Argentina wants for the opposite way, if you see the stripes claimed by Argentina and UK, those are the same, and with the expiration of Antarctic Treaty in 2041, the things can get a little bit obscure.

[MigBuster 2,884]

Another dispute over oil again - whod have thought - hopefully it wont come to anything though - besides I dont think the Argentine FAA have half the resources they did in 82 - and pretty much the same ancient jets.

 

With a determined Sea assualt taking a lot of casualties - Argentina might be able to retake the Islands, and get a nice big airfield along with the bargain though not sure how theyd hold it.

 

We could then send our task force again...with GR9s only...great!

[Silverbolt 104]

Another dispute over oil again - whod have thought - hopefully it wont come to anything though - besides I dont think the Argentine FAA have half the resources they did in 82 - and pretty much the same ancient jets.

 

With a determined Sea assualt taking a lot of casualties - Argentina might be able to retake the Islands, and get a nice big airfield along with the bargain though not sure how theyd hold it.

 

We could then send our task force again...with GR9s only...great!

 

i'm pretty skeptical about the Oil matter, till where deep Oil exploration is worthfull? here we have all that Pre-Salt Oil sheet BS, and we're spending literraly mountains of money, to get expensive Oil...recently our Bio-Fuel resource had an production drop and we had to import gas from venezuela.

 

i can't imagine UK situation, the Main Britain Island is thousand of miles away from Falklands and it seems that in the Falklands Islands don't have a proper structure to refine or even distribuct the extracted Oil, looks like a Logistical nightmare for me.

Edited February 20, 2010 by Silverbolt

[+Gocad 26]

i can't imagine UK situation, the Main Britain Island is thousand of miles away from Falklands and it seems that in the Falklands Islands don't have a proper structure to refine or even distribuct the extracted Oil, looks like a Logistical nightmare for me.

 

It sounds to me that the oil drilling is in its early stages, so commercial use seems still a bit away. But one should keep in mind that the oil price kinda affects which oil fields are profitable to use. It should be remembered that when the oil price rose up 100 $ some time ago a lot of of new oil fields were suddenly "discovered". In fact most of the fields were already known, but only after the rise of the price per barrel it became profitable to make use of them. It could probably be the same for the Falklands. (Not to mention that it wouldn't make that much a difference whether you have to send you tankers all the way down to the Falklands as compared to the route to the oil producers in the Middle East... )

[dsawan 624]

Argentina would have a tough time holding on to the isalnds. The veinte cinco de may has been scrapped. She has not invested in an amphibious assault carrier(I.e. Mistral class that russia is buying) for force projection,very little military purchases for combat jets like the Mirage 2000D which would be useful to them in strike role, let alone air superiority. I do say this would make a good campaign for a strike fighters 2 scenario.

[+Typhoid 231]

just political posturing in advance of oil lease negotiations.

[Slartibartfast 153]

Was wondering when this joker would put in his 2 Bolivars worth in...

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/falklandislands/7293985/Hugo-Chavez-demands-Queen-returns-Falkland-Islands-to-Argentina.html

[+Gocad 26]

Somebody call Juan Carlos please.

[macelena 1,070]

I´m pretty sure to say that Argentina by nature did never want the war (maybe the high military staff government, but neither the lower rank military nor the people who just stuck together as a country) and shall never find itself in the awful circumstances that led to the war in 1982. That´s what i can say after smelling the Argentine members here as an outsider.

 

As Spaniard, I can understand both sides. I know what do the Argentines feel about the islands, for them is like they were usurped and humilliated since the British took over in 1833. However, i can say that we wouldn´t launch Operation Rosario (Gibraltar would have been so easy, and the Jack is still there) but we would execute Corporate (we almost entered war with Morocco in 2002 for a rock smaller than a football field).

 

For what i know, the Falklands War was the most crazy ludicrous war, between two western countries wich i considerate friendlies, allies, and brothers to mine. I don´t think there is gonna be any mess. And this time I don´t feel down for having no show, it would be madness.

[Sidevvinder 43]

Hello, I want to give my opinion as an Argentine, because no Argentine opined yet.

First and foremost Argentina ah not begun to reclaim the sovereignty of the Falklands from this month due to oil, but has been calling the end of dictatorship in which we went to war, early in the mandate of Raul Alfonsin in 1983.

Besides the nation is not capable of any military action, despite continuing to have strategic superiority, the government of Nestor Kirchner and Cristina Fernandez, the last two presidents of Argentina, have not invested in the military because of its ideology of armed forces are dangerous because they created coups in Latin America, something which I disagree because that negligence occurs when too much pressure on governments and policies of other nations, such as USA.

Just to show we do not have to compete with all our FAA nor against those 4 Eurofighters that are in the Falklands.

The Islanders need not decide, the islands are found in continental shelf of Argentina, very close to the Argentine sea. Of course, the Islanders are going to be British if they have one of the better status of life worldwide.

I think the British press is also being very hard, in Argentina there is almost no grudge against England, even for the two British invasions in the nineteenth century not by year's war 82.

Ultime and they wanted to comment that Argentina has the support of almost the entire block of Rio, and composed almost all the countries of South and Central America obviously not counting U.S.

 

Greetings!

[Sidevvinder 43]

Here a note: http://en.mercopress.com/2010/02/23/falklands-full-support-for-argentina-from-latinamerican-and-caribbean-leaders

[Dogzero1 16]

I'm pretty sure it political muppetry on behalf of those tin pot, big hat'd, medal wearing South Americans, but if it isn't, Great Britain will defend those Islands of ours to the bitter end of Argentina or any of the other puppet states that support them. I have absolutely nothing against the Argentinian people, just their successive governments. I lost a family member in the Falklands war and I have done two tours there myself. Its ours, it's British:salute:

Edited February 23, 2010 by Dogzero1

[MigBuster 2,884]

That about says it all - despite the history behind it all the conflict is still very much in the minds of all - The Falklands will never be given away now.

[Sidevvinder 43]

That about says it all - despite the history behind it all the conflict is still very much in the minds of all - The Falklands will never be given away now.

 

accurate, but never stop to fight, sperm that always a good dialogue rather than by arms, to prevent unnecessary deaths.

My condolences Dogzero.

 

Las Malvinas fueron, son y seran Argentinas!

 

 

 

[Dogzero1 16]

accurate, but never stop to fight, sperm that always a good dialogue rather than by arms, to prevent unnecessary deaths.

My condolences Dogzero.

 

Las Malvinas fueron, son y seran Argentinas!

 

Sorry I dont understand you. Like I said previously, I am not against the Argentinian people. I am all for going to war with their silly military, stupid politicians and that stupid Hugo Chavez idiot. Did you see him ranting on TV? What an idiot. He still thinks the Queen runs our Country. If I had my way I'd drop a low yield mk28 tactical nuke on his presidential palace. We will defend British soil, people and British interests from all those foreign nations that threaten us.

 

Edited February 24, 2010 by Dogzero1

[Silverbolt 104]

Well, we must remember that we have both sides here in the forum.

just to make things clear, nobody will enter in war for those islands in the next 20 years, in a very optimistic plan to argentinean armed forces.

 

Argentina is not complaining about the ownership of the islands and yes because of outlaw actions by UK disrespecting an UN resolution.

 

IMO, Barking higher will not demonstrate anyhing, specially in a no way possible war scenario as this is.

 

keep in mind that Hugo chavez can do nothing about this issue , he is just keeping things worse to Argentinean side, but that's not most that he can do about this matter, so, ignore such a person is the ideal.

[Sidevvinder 43]

Sorry I dont understand you. Like I said previously, I am not against the Argentinian people. I am all for going to war with their silly military, stupid politicians and that stupid Hugo Chavez idiot. Did you see him ranting on TV? What an idiot. He still thinks the Queen runs our Country. If I had my way I'd drop a low yield mk28 tactical nuke on his presidential palace. We will defend British soil, people and British interests from all those foreign nations that threaten us.

 

 

OK, I did not say they do not defend it, but not everything works out with force, there are also diplomatic and luckily today, with the same is handled in Argentina. and exactly why there is conflict, I'm not saying not to protect their supposedly "piece of land" only say that they are violating international treaties.

Also I think UK still maintains the ideology of several centuries ago, actually today I see UK as a country of colonies, as was always true.

And we got a good conversation and respect, you posed a couple of tracks on Argentina's sovereignty in the islands so that people from other countries see the two sides of the coin.

 

1 - ANALYSIS OF PROXIMITY

 

Capital Falkland Islands: Puerto Argentino (Stanley)

Distance between London, United Kingdom and Puerto Argentino (Stanley): 12,700 Miles / 8000 Miles

Distance between Rio Grande, Argentina and Puerto Argentino (Stanley): 800 Kilometers / 500 Miles

CONCLUSION: Rio Grande is the next city to the Islands and Argentina the closest nation. Within a radius of 800 kilometers (500 miles) from Puerto Argentino (Stanley) find nothing but water and Argentine mainland and island.

"The Falkland Islands belong geographically to the South American continent, and for this reason are a natural part of Argentine territorial domain, in whose proximity they are."

 

The Sea Convention is a lengthy document produced within the field of United Nations in 1982, dedicated to legislate and define the jurisdictions in the waters and seabed.

The seabed is a natural extension of the land surface and integrate the so-called continental margins, now covered by the sea. The Sea Convention has established a complex procedure for claiming cost countries such seabed. It has been estimated that the territories that correspond to the Republic of Argentina in this condition have an extension of 2,500,000 square kilometers, being in this case, and according to the provisions of the Convention, over ocean areas belonging to the so - exclusive economic zone ".

The land surface of the portion oceanica are obviously islands. In the case of Argentina is the Malvinas, South Georgia and South Sandwich Islands, in addition to other minors. They are continental islands as in all cases emerge from platforms or continental margins.

The islands have been usurped by the United Kingdom. The seabed and ocean masses are subject to the provisions of the Sea Convention

"The Falkland Islands are geologically related to the Patagonia."

 

 

The oldest occupation, effective and continuing on the islands were Hispanic. The English, meanwhile, during the eighteenth century, explored the Patagonian coast (now southern Argentina) for supply points for their whaling ships. Against this background, Spain instituted the Viceroyalty of the Rio de la Plata (1776), because I feel that Lima (Other Viceroyalty in South America) was very far to exercise effective control.

 

Following the Declaration of Independence (July 9, 1816), much of the territory of the Viceroyalty of the River Plate became part of Argentina, including the Falkland Islands, South Georgia and South Sandwich.

 

And attention with this:

The British flag frigate Clio, made his appearance in the islands on 20 December 1832, and after a raid in the vicinity of Port Egmont, was presented in front of Puerto Soledad (January 2, 1833). Pinedo sent two of his officers on board the Clio to require the English captain the reason for their presence. Not slow to jump aboard personally Sarandi where Argentina beat the boss of the tenor of his instructions from disposition of SMB had orders to take the Falkland Islands and granted twenty-four hours Pinedo to haul down the flag of Argentina and proceed with the evacuation.

 

These data were extracted verbatim from Internet sites.

 

FUENTE: Revista GENTE N° 884, 1 de Julio de 1982

 

These data were extracted verbatim from Internet sites.

 

SOURCE: PEOPLE Magazine No. 884, July 1, 1982

 

Particularly I think in 1982 and in 2010 these thoughts of colonization of his country have not changed.

 

I know that you think about this, putting aside their fanaticism for their banners.

 

Greetings!

 

PS: Sorry if you do not understand some expressions, I am using the Google translator, I will speak, understand and read, but I have difficulty writing, but not really write very well..

[Silverbolt 104]

 

 

1 - ANALYSIS OF PROXIMITY

 

Capital Falkland Islands: Puerto Argentino (Stanley)

Distance between London, United Kingdom and Puerto Argentino (Stanley): 12,700 Miles / 8000 Miles

Distance between Rio Grande, Argentina and Puerto Argentino (Stanley): 800 Kilometers / 500 Miles

CONCLUSION: Rio Grande is the next city to the Islands and Argentina the closest nation. Within a radius of 800 kilometers (500 miles) from Puerto Argentino (Stanley) find nothing but water and Argentine mainland and island.

"The Falkland Islands belong geographically to the South American continent, and for this reason are a natural part of Argentine territorial domain, in whose proximity they are."

 

The Sea Convention is a lengthy document produced within the field of United Nations in 1982, dedicated to legislate and define the jurisdictions in the waters and seabed.

The seabed is a natural extension of the land surface and integrate the so-called continental margins, now covered by the sea. The Sea Convention has established a complex procedure for claiming cost countries such seabed. It has been estimated that the territories that correspond to the Republic of Argentina in this condition have an extension of 2,500,000 square kilometers, being in this case, and according to the provisions of the Convention, over ocean areas belonging to the so - exclusive economic zone ".

The land surface of the portion oceanica are obviously islands. In the case of Argentina is the Malvinas, South Georgia and South Sandwich Islands, in addition to other minors. They are continental islands as in all cases emerge from platforms or continental margins.

The islands have been usurped by the United Kingdom. The seabed and ocean masses are subject to the provisions of the Sea Convention

"The Falkland Islands are geologically related to the Patagonia."

 

 

The oldest occupation, effective and continuing on the islands were Hispanic. The English, meanwhile, during the eighteenth century, explored the Patagonian coast (now southern Argentina) for supply points for their whaling ships. Against this background, Spain instituted the Viceroyalty of the Rio de la Plata (1776), because I feel that Lima (Other Viceroyalty in South America) was very far to exercise effective control.

 

Following the Declaration of Independence (July 9, 1816), much of the territory of the Viceroyalty of the River Plate became part of Argentina, including the Falkland Islands, South Georgia and South Sandwich.

 

And attention with this:

The British flag frigate Clio, made his appearance in the islands on 20 December 1832, and after a raid in the vicinity of Port Egmont, was presented in front of Puerto Soledad (January 2, 1833). Pinedo sent two of his officers on board the Clio to require the English captain the reason for their presence. Not slow to jump aboard personally Sarandi where Argentina beat the boss of the tenor of his instructions from disposition of SMB had orders to take the Falkland Islands and granted twenty-four hours Pinedo to haul down the flag of Argentina and proceed with the evacuation.

 

These data were extracted verbatim from Internet sites.

 

FUENTE: Revista GENTE N° 884, 1 de Julio de 1982

 

These data were extracted verbatim from Internet sites.

 

SOURCE: PEOPLE Magazine No. 884, July 1, 1982

 

Particularly I think in 1982 and in 2010 these thoughts of colonization of his country have not changed.

 

I know that you think about this, putting aside their fanaticism for their banners.

 

Greetings!

 

PS: Sorry if you do not understand some expressions, I am using the Google translator, I will speak, understand and read, but I have difficulty writing, but not really write very well..

 

well my friend, unfortunately those argues are not well accepted, the sea convention has an 200nm(IIRC UN want to extend to 300nm) limit, not 500.

 

and well, not geographically isn't also a good argue, you can use the same argue to antarctic claimings, Argentina, Brazil and Chile also do such a claimings even if we are in different continents.

 

in other hand we have the colonialism , that is anti-liberal and modern.

 

even if UK colonialism , i think is a way different nowadays...do the overseas citzens have british citzenship and all legal rights?

[MigBuster 2,884]

Yep I'm pretty sure the Falklands is too far out I'm afraid.

 

If bringing History into it - The British have sovereignty claims since 1690 - which was never renounced (apparently) a bit before Argentina even existed. The French, US and Spain have all been in control at some point

 

 

The history though is now irrelevant.

 

Like Gibraltar the Island is now populated with people who want to stay British - so its too late - they wont be removed and there is nothing Argentina can do about it, legally or not.

 

1982 screwed Argentina's chances of getting it back for the foreseeable future.

 

 

The apparent ranting by Hugo Chavez is just making things worse for Argentina!

[+Dave 2,322]

KEEP THE FALKLANDS BRITISH!

[+Dave 2,322]

On that note. Chavez is trying to get Argentina involved in something they don't want and from what I can tell is even care. He needs to work on his human rights record before sabre ratteling for other people.