Patch December 2010-C is out!

[+Dave 2,322]

I think this all boils down to one thing: patch C broke something that not only was working in patch B, it's ALWAYS worked since the first in 2002. It's also a fairly obvious error that should've been spotted. The prop thing was irritating, but it didn't fundamentally alter the way you had to play the game. Ditto the wingmen disappearing heading home. Being forced to start in the air DOES alter things and I think people are a bit frayed around the edges now.

Is it a major game-breaking problem? No. However, it does indeed appear to be a leading indicator of bigger problems to come and I guess people are hoping by raising the alarm now they can halt that decline and get TK back on the track he was on before.

 

Right on JM, right on....

[FalconC45 162]

I think this all boils down to one thing: patch C broke something that not only was working in patch B, it's ALWAYS worked since the first in 2002. It's also a fairly obvious error that should've been spotted. The prop thing was irritating, but it didn't fundamentally alter the way you had to play the game. Ditto the wingmen disappearing heading home. Being forced to start in the air DOES alter things and I think people are a bit frayed around the edges now.

Is it a major game-breaking problem? No. However, it does indeed appear to be a leading indicator of bigger problems to come and I guess people are hoping by raising the alarm now they can halt that decline and get TK back on the track he was on before.

 

You hit the nail right on with that. I totally agree.

 

Falcon

[FANATIC MODDER 118]

I did the stupidity to buy exp2. Instead of "flying", I spend almost all my free time trying to find a solution about the airstart problem (impossible), then extracting all the exp2 extra stuff to try it to older versions of SF, (1 & 2) again impossible, even with SF2E latest patch. It destroyed me all the pleasure (I feel like it's an "action game" without it). I found that the editor sometimes doesn't work properly too (I tried to created SR-71 missions that never flew to their projected alt.). In general, I have a difficulty to understand what these people are trying to do.

[+Stary 2,427]

Fanatic Modder you can't use SF2 stuff in series 1... what are you trying to do?

[+Dave 2,322]

Stary he is trying to find some magic way to get SF2 stuff to work in SF1 based on his argument that we should be making mods for both versions. Instead he wasted all his time.

[DWCAce 19]

Right now I'm doing some reinstalling of my SF2 stuff, gonna make separate install for Exp2 and hopefully extract the Lightnings and copy them to my other installs....

[+Stary 2,427]

Stary he is trying to find some magic way to get SF2 stuff to work in SF1 based on his argument that we should be making mods for both versions. Instead he wasted all his time.

 

I know he's trying to do impossible, plainly just to have another reason for ranting on series2...

[JediMaster 451]

I tried importing stuff from SF2 into EAW and it didn't work at all. Obviously both programs must be crap, right?

[+Stary 2,427]

I tried importing stuff from SF2 into EAW and it didn't work at all. Obviously both programs must be crap, right?

 

I find your lack of faith disturbing, Master...

 

I exported Crysis Warhead graphics engine to Secret Weapons Of The Luftwaffe and it didn't worked so well, must be me doing something wrong

[+Prowler1111 14]

..Depends..i take FSX stuff and put it into SF series and works!.. :rofl:

 

Happy new year everyone!

 

 

PS:Click on the link and you get the idea...

[+Dave 2,322]

Yeah but when do I get a damn pony?

[+daddyairplanes 10,244]

sheesh people. all ya gotta do... step one back up regularly so you can go back to how it was if you choose to. Step 2 read the reviews from the folks here on how the new patch/expansion pack/ game is going and whats good whats broken. Step three if you think its worth it, get it! Step four it you get it and dont like it go back to saved version that you like until the definitve patch fixing all is released, or Dave gets his pony whichever comes first. last i checked you have the freedom to buy or not buy as you please. if i missed the line in Obamacare where every American is issued TW sims let me know. and yes you have the right to b!7ch about whats broken (real or imagined) and we common users have the right to pop negative votes on you and if its bad enough the moderators have the ability to remove yer b!7chin! if your feelings are hurt i am probably talkin to you. to all others i apologize.

 

and BTW Dave,i shall now use you and your pony in place of hell freezing over:rofl:

[+Dave 2,322]

daddyirplanes

 

Does that mean I will never see the pony?

[+Stary 2,427]

good one Prowler

[+allenjb42 4,234]

Personally I subscribe to the cock-up theory.

I think TK disabled runway starts when he was testing the patch so that he could start with the plane in the air, and then forgot to enable it again when he finalised the patch for release.

[JediMaster 451]

Only problem with that theory is you can do it from inside the game menu, so you don't need to "hardwire" it for air starts.

 

Now if while he does his debugging he does something different to get in that bypasses the menus and their options, ok, but I'm unaware of such a method.

 

Anyway, whether it was a deliberate action that he failed to reverse before the patch was released or just a side effect of something else he did, it's a glaring QA mistake that he really didn't need.

[Lexx_Luthor 57]

Jedi (last page)::

...a leading indicator of bigger problems to come and I guess people are hoping by raising the alarm now they can halt that decline and get TK back on the track he was on before.

 

I tried the alarm thing, sorta, it didn't work. I see things that are invisible to others, things going back to 2008. My SF Story is the tale of a loner bending the game to my own brazed honeycomb steel will. Even as a loner, I totally depend on the real modders creating, over this entire last decade, nearly the entire SAC and PVO line up, Vee bombers, and now Lincoln and TSR.2, not to mention ADC and DA line ups. Who'd a guessed that would have happened in a combat flight TheSim? I still can't get over it, amazing. uh...okay, doing my own game thing, I make slashing compromises and insane FlightEngine settings to make a deep visual environment that brings out the best in these stratospheric aircraft. I see things in the game few or no others suspect is out there. Doing this makes TK a bit edgy.

 

...Anyways, my first clue of what may be a "decline" -- for me -- was SF1 Patch 2008. Being alone, few or none here would appreciate this, but in that Patch, TK went to a different sunset sky that I cannot use for my very high altitude game flying, and it seems this can't be modded away. More 2008 tragedy was an AI feature that, sure, may be useful in the stock game with stock aircraft, but is near useless with another other important type of plane set: This feature is the AI BVR engagement, which is not really BVR, but BVR RHM engagement only. AI aircraft must be armed with at least one radar missile to engage BVR. This rules out the AI doing radar BVR engagements with IRM or guns only. This is something that should be "on the scope" for the new Korea campaign modders if they plan on including F3D having a big long range radar but no long range radar missiles.

 

These odd 2008 changes to the game told me TK was starting down a wrong path -- for me. The BVR RHM feature works for the stock game I suppose, because stock game fighters mostly either have big BVR radars and come armed with big RHM, or they are visual day fighters (say, Suez game) with no big radar to begin with. So no "F3D Problem" arises in the stock game. That said, TK is still the best today, and is the ONLY game developer out there, simply because of Cold War jets. That's it! Without TK's game and modders, I would not be doing SAC vs PVO at all, zip, nothing. I'd still be playing Master of Orion 1.

 

It was recently revealed that the new game has reduced horizon distances, which is a terrible backwards step from the past. And TK has been talking about hardcoding limits on some FlightEngine variables so modded game users will be unable to use settings that can cause problems in modded newer games. Retreating to hard coded limitations to cover up new flaws appearing in modding could be a bad sign.

 

Being the standup honest guy TK is, he politely tells poasters if they don't like the game, they should find other games that appeal to them better. At times he gets mad at me for never upgrading, but, I finally found another game that appeals to me better than his current games::

 

Strike Fighters Project 1, 2006

 

---

 

I will say this. Many of us asked TK for sky blue changing with altitude. He did it in 2008. He's fixed a bug or two I found long ago. The SF Moon, for example, had a retrograde orbit. This was a whopper, and nobody noticed it. I whined about it, threw a temper tampon on Thudwire. The SF Moon went prograde orbit in the very next Patch sometime in 2005. I figure there was an errant or missed negative sign somewhere in the SF Maths. He fixed it.

 

One of the reasons I love TK so much, czech it out ~> http://bbs.thirdwire.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=2257 (this was after the orbit fix). Militant radical RAF Vulcan fans, and fans of manual or auto star nav would know this is a nice touch TK made here.

[+daddyairplanes 10,244]

daddyirplanes

 

Does that mean I will never see the pony?

 

 

as its a family forum i will use the deployed version of the saying: people at FOBs want ice water:rofl:

[+Dave 2,322]

Family forum my ass......

[FastCargo 412]

And TK has been talking about hardcoding limits on some FlightEngine variables so modded game users will be unable to use settings that can cause problems in modded newer games. Retreating to hard coded limitations to cover up new flaws appearing in modding could be a bad sign.

 

Oh I hope the heck not...there really isn't any reason for it. And it would play havoc with some of the enviromental mods out there.

 

FC

[+ST0RM 145]

Was the inclement weather bug ever fixed with the Exp2 plus patches? I'm no longer running either Expansion packs, so my SF2 is only patched up to June 2010 standard. In the Falklands install, and every other install with Jun 2010, I'm also getting the low ceilings and rain. I've even gone into the *name*.ini and edited the WeatherChance. Nothing works.

 

-S

 

EDITED: Just and read much of the same reports over at the Thirdwire forum. So at least I see it's still not fixed. But TK was dismissing it as simply chance that you got stuck with that weather and not a bug.

Edited January 7, 2011 by ST0RM

[Lexx_Luthor 57]

FC, the 10 December thread, p.4, third poast ~> http://bbs.thirdwire.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=8077&start=24

 

I feel bad for stepping in that patch TECH SUPPORT thread and me not even having the game (SF2) but I may yet still go for SF2 and when I saw TK use the word "hardcode" related to DetailMesh and Clips, two of my fave gems in the game, I poked my nose in. I couldn't explain how I never use the stock grafix that may be conflicting with DM and Clips, so I got and stayed the heck out a few poasts later.

 

 

...as for thread crashing: Dave I apologize for making you work overtime in the -9G thread. Sorry.

[+Dave 2,322]

...as for thread crashing: Dave I apologize for making you work overtime in the -9G thread. Sorry.

 

Just trying to keep it on topic.

[FastCargo 412]

Well, from reading the thread, it sounds like what he said was the only sure way to prevent such things was to hardcode it...I don't interpret that as an intent to do so.

 

FC

[+76.IAP-Blackbird 3,557]

I use still the non Expansion instalation, cause I can`t help myself, this all looks more and more like a public betatest/moneycash. Sorry for sounding a bit harsh.

 

I liked SF1, it was new, new aera, cool birds and all was realy simple and good, now we have a bit of everything but nothing realy works well. There are companies out there who program for the public comunity, cause they know how many people will create some mods and additional stuff for the core product. Just take a look at "Operation Flashpoint" or the newer "Armed Assault 2" Ok not realy flightsims but maybe let me use FSX as a good example, a good priced product, large amount of workload and manpower stands behind this product. But FS9 still lifes today, cause of the large amount of addons, doesn`T matter if they are free or not.

But TK knows some of you guys here very well, the betatester, the modder who post on his side, but SF2 still seems not very modderfriendly, excepts the exporter tool. Some hardcoded stuff is like living behind a wall, I know what it means I`m from the eastern art of europe, even as I were young at that time.

 

When I look around, I see so many talented people here, FC, Eric J, Dave, Bongodriver, Ravenclaw, Stary and many more (sorry for not post them all) I can`t even imagenie what those people would do out of this "core"sim. Just Starys Terrains are an absolutly must have for everyone! Damn was that an imrpoevemtn for the game. Sad we can`t do more.

 

my 2 cents

Edited January 7, 2011 by 76.IAP-Blackbird