Decals

[amariani 4,882]

Pretty sure this has been asked before but, I'm gonna ask again. What causes decal bleed? Does it has to do with the 3d model itself?

[bazillius 1,258]

i am not sure what do you mean "bleed", but if model in one piese, decals plases.. mm.. for example if you place on left cide, it places on every left mesh of the part like deck of cards. if it happens you need to fix 3d model cutting off the place where to place decal to apart linked object. i think its only thje way but i can be wrong

[bazillius 1,258]

ahh.. i think i understand. Your decal must be rounded with transoparent pixels. no one pixel have to touch the edge of a decal, but transparent.

[+russouk2004 6,958]

yeah...tk reccomends at least 5 pixels minimum from image edge....  if you are a modder with 3ds max exporting with decals feature usually eliminates bleed...I had some models that had bleed...this feature fixed it

 

btw Amariani   how is the pc dilemma going ?

Edited February 14, 2020 by russouk2004

[+yakarov79 11,084]

I've also noticed that sometimes decals will bleed on model exported with 2010 exporter (last one -  with specular and bump maps) if you use older exporter bleeding is not appearing. 

[Wrench 9,847]

bleed is usually caused by unwelded meshe of the lod. Basically, a hole or crack that allows the tga to be pulled into.

only fix is in MAX

[amariani 4,882]

9 hours ago, russouk2004 said:

yeah...tk reccomends at least 5 pixels minimum from image edge....  if you are a modder with 3ds max exporting with decals feature usually eliminates bleed...I had some models that had bleed...this feature fixed it

 

btw Amariani   how is the pc dilemma going ?

Got a new computer asap since I use it for work also. Slowly building my mods back from what was in my back ups.

[+daddyairplanes 10,236]

19 hours ago, Wrench said:

bleed is usually caused by unwelded meshe of the lod. Basically, a hole or crack that allows the tga to be pulled into.

only fix is in MAX

that or move the decal (with proper distance from edge) to a close enough place on the mesh. sometimes you gotta be 18 inches from a particular part rather than 15 to get it to work.

like everyone else said, my most common has been running up to close to the edge, although i have used it FOR that effect on some of the airliners (usually to get a stripe to the back end of the bird). most of my lod issues wound up being something completely screwy (thinkin of when i tried to do the VIP C-17 for Qatar, with "Qatar" on the bottom. didnt happen due to a wicked seam)

good to hear your making a comeback

[Wrench 9,847]

Nope, sorry, no in all cases.

Example: Pasko's Mosquito's. the RAF roundel on the aft section of the fuselage, bleeds on the upper portion of the nose (which is all one mesh -- the majority of the problems come from the modelers NOT dividing the model into enough sub-sections). I'll post screenies later to show the effect

[+yakarov79 11,084]

15 hours ago, Wrench said:

the modelers NOT dividing the model into enough sub-sections

if modder wants to keep the smoothness of the fuselage or other part.. this can be a pain in the ass.

Sometimes the shape of a node is a problem.

But you are right that Mossie nose is a nightmare - that can be resolved if we have max file.

[Wrench 9,847]

I agree, in part. I fully understand the need for smoothness, but for decaling and damaging (tga/dds) it is kind of important that there are enough divisions. I can imagine the issues in smoothing, especially on something like the Mossi, which is known for it's smooth shape. Mind you, we ARE dealing with a lod  in this case, from 2005, when a lot of what we now know, simply wasn't known!

below, promised decal bleed screenie

if you remove the decal in the decals ini, obviously the issue goes away.  but, the serial numbers and/or "plane-in-squadron' letter/number may cause it to return.

[+daddyairplanes 10,236]

that looks familiar (and i havent worked on the Mossie)

[amariani 4,882]

55 minutes ago, Wrench said:

I agree, in part. I fully understand the need for smoothness, but for decaling and damaging (tga/dds) it is kind of important that there are enough divisions. I can imagine the issues in smoothing, especially on something like the Mossi, which is known for it's smooth shape. Mind you, we ARE dealing with a lod  in this case, from 2005, when a lot of what we now know, simply wasn't known!

below, promised decal bleed screenie

if you remove the decal in the decals ini, obviously the issue goes away.  but, the serial numbers and/or "plane-in-squadron' letter/number may cause it to return.

This is exactly what I was referring to.

[Wilches 1,172]

We need a new and updated Mossie. 

[Wrench 9,847]

indeed. ALL of Pasko's  birds need new replacements, for one reason or another (as listed above). Don't even get me started on the Wildcat ...

[+mue 715]

14 hours ago, Wrench said:

I agree, in part. I fully understand the need for smoothness, but for decaling and damaging (tga/dds) it is kind of important that there are enough divisions. I can imagine the issues in smoothing, especially on something like the Mossi, which is known for it's smooth shape. Mind you, we ARE dealing with a lod  in this case, from 2005, when a lot of what we now know, simply wasn't known!

below, promised decal bleed screenie

if you remove the decal in the decals ini, obviously the issue goes away.  but, the serial numbers and/or "plane-in-squadron' letter/number may cause it to return.

The problem here is, that the model was exported without setting the option AllowDecals=True.
With the option AllowDecals=True, your mesh can be as smooth as you like without getting decal bleeding problems.

[+russouk2004 6,958]

Modelling software is out there and accesible for free...blender...for example...maybe if some learned to model we might have more of what people want....some are too busy to drop stuff and remodel old stuff....just an idea.

I knew fuck all about moels ,but after some tutorials such as mustangs....I learnt quick....and was able to get out basic models quite soon thereafter   ie Tjet and the moth and early P47 N version so its doable

im NOT having a go or a moan ,just its easy once you know basics of 3ds max....and each time you make summat you find ways to do it better and quicker....im by no stretch of the imagination an expert...still amateur,but im happy with most of what I do....and still learning.

if you decide to try....watch tutorials...there are great simple ones out there...they even supply model to try and to look at to see how its done....

if people willing to try im willing to offer any assistance,as im sure will other modders.

Edited February 17, 2020 by russouk2004

[+yakarov79 11,084]

1 hour ago, russouk2004 said:

Modelling software is out there and accesible for free...blender...for example...maybe if some learned to model we might have more of what people want....some are too busy to drop stuff and remodel old stuff....just an idea.

I knew fuck all about moels ,but after some tutorials such as mustangs....I learnt quick....and was able to get out basic models quite soon thereafter   ie Tjet and the moth and early P47 N version so its doable

im NOT having a go or a moan ,just its easy once you know basics of 3ds max....and each time you make summat you find ways to do it better and quicker....im by no stretch of the imagination an expert...still amateur,but im happy with most of what I do....and still learning.

if you decide to try....watch tutorials...there are great simple ones out there...they even supply model to try and to look at to see how its done....

if people willing to try im willing to offer any assistance,as im sure will other modders.

Bravo.

 

If assistance is needed I can offer some help as well. 

promise I will be forbearing.

 

[+daddyairplanes 10,236]

a laugh and a thanks (for all the advice you give the community at large) jarek

 

[+Nyghtfall 2,154]

As for tutorials (to learn Blender):

I lately found a very good modelling-tutorial about creating an anvil from start to finish (incl. texturing) from a guy named "Blender Guru". This is an intermediate tutorial, but there is also a beginners tutorial (which I have not watched yet, though).

I really like his way to explain things.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yi87Dap_WOc&list=PLjEaoINr3zgHJVJF3T3CFUAZ6z11jKg6a&t=0s

Maybe this encourages more people to learn blender.

[+russouk2004 6,958]

im so used to 3ds max I couldnt even fin the scene rotate gizmo in blender lol....it is a good programme tho

[+Nyghtfall 2,154]

12 minutes ago, russouk2004 said:

im so used to 3ds max I couldnt even fin the scene rotate gizmo in blender lol....it is a good programme tho

Just hold Middle Mouse Button and rotate like you've never rotated before.

[+russouk2004 6,958]

lol...dont have it now.....whats it like for animating and mapping stuff? any easier than max ? 

[+Nyghtfall 2,154]

I don't know, how to map or animate stuff in Max...so no comparison possible for me, sorry.

My Impression of mapping in Blender is, that it's no rocket-science to map parts. But it can be hard work to get complex parts unwrapped the way you like, but I guess, that is a general problem and not blender-specific.

I've started to play around with Blender again after some break (and started a new plane...as always...N-102 Fang this time) and it is fun again and one can learn new stuff every day. I hope to someday find solutions for every problems I encounter within the modelling and finish a plane. Everyone should at least once try to build something and see how difficult modelling easy looking things can be.

Edited February 20, 2020 by Nyghtfall
spelling