The real MIG-21F

[UllyB 1,206]

As you all know MIG-21F had three guns only for air to air missions. MIG-21F-13 had just one. I searched the files, TK didn't bother to make two distinct models, his MIG-21F, in SF1 and SF2 looks identical with MIG-21F-13 and has just one gun and that forward antenna (MIG-21F had no antenna). Question: Is anyone of you who, for historical reasons, somehow build the other two guns into a MIG-21F model or improvised with some very thin models of gun to match them ? If so I'd be happy to have them. If not can they be done or made from something existent as material. I ask that because all the guns LODs available are big and one can't do much with them. I am open to suggestions, I really want a MIG-21F model with 3 guns one way or another.Thank you

[+strahi 1,101]

12 minutes ago, UllyB said:

As you all know MIG-21F had three guns only for air to air missions. MIG-21F-13 had just one. I searched the files, TK didn't bother to make two distinct models, his MIG-21F, in SF1 and SF2 looks identical with MIG-21F-13 and has just one gun and that forward antenna (MIG-21F had no antenna). Question: Is anyone of you who, for historical reasons, somehow build the other two guns into a MIG-21F model or improvised with some very thin models of gun to match them ? If so I'd be happy to have them. If not can they be done or made from something existent as material. I ask that because all the guns LODs available are big and one can't do much with them. I am open to suggestions, I really want a MIG-21F model with 3 guns one way or another.Thank you

MiG-21F is the very early model, produced in small number. Weapons, two 30 mm guns, no rockets. F13 version is more liked and waited. Name is from K-13 (R-3) missiles, 2x.

[+Crusader 2,101]

 

[UllyB 1,206]

Thanks a lot fellows, I didn't know that it was already made an earlier model.

[bazillius 1,258]

OH MY GOD! I just discovered  thst I havent MiG-21F in my collection. Its fixed now Thanks to everyone in this topic. By the way, Will someone do MiG-21SMT? Or I have to model it by myself? This is most wanted aircraft for me

[UllyB 1,206]

1 hour ago, bazillius said:

OH MY GOD! I just discovered  thst I havent MiG-21F in my collection. Its fixed now Thanks to everyone in this topic. By the way, Will someone do MiG-21SMT? Or I have to model it by myself? This is most wanted aircraft for me

I read about it, it says it's similar to F-13 but superior due to some real upgrade. Why do you want a model made  if it doesn't look unique ? I'm just curious.

[bazillius 1,258]

2 hours ago, UllyB said:

it's similar

NNNnnnope.  It has Humpback

[UllyB 1,206]

Aha...Well only for a keen eye is a difference here. I admit, I would have had a hard time to tell the difference between this one and one from the second or third generation.

[bazillius 1,258]

I am fallen in love in this hump.

[+Crusader 2,101]

Last in the the RuAF-only S, SM, SMT series. With extra Toplivo (fuel) in the Xtra-large spine.
Unstable to fly and not liked by the pilots.
They've decided to redo it, the result = MiG-21bis
But yes, the look of it is monstrous 

Now, where is RussoUK .. he has the MiG-21 stuff..

Edited April 5, 2021 by Crusader

[+streakeagle 871]

When you see all the confusion about MiG-21 designations including Third Wire games, you have to remember, prior to the fall of the Soviet Union, MiGs were classified visually into their NATO designations: i.e. Fishbed C, D, E, J, L, N etc. Letters were assigned as new visual differences appeared. So a Russian variant and its export might get the same letter because they looked the same even though they may have significant internal differences. Likewise, two variants that were very similar but had some major visual change would have different letters. What little that was reported on actual Soviet designations was confusing in the West. After information became available, documents continue to mix up old NATO guesses for Soviet designations versus actual designations. Add to that the fact that the MiG factory had their own production series numbers for variants independent of the Soviet government's official MiG designation.

As someone who grew up with the NATO designations, a MiG-21F and MiG-21F-13 were indistinguishable: both were publicly known as MiG-21F Fishbed C to me and in fact, I didn't know about the original production variant until maybe the late 80s/early 90s. Among the Third Wire designations, the one reflecting the most confusion from my perspective is the MiG-21PFV. There was no MiG-21PFV. The Vietnamese flew the same export variants of the PF series flown by other clients. Russian sources don't note any special version with a "V" for Vietnam or some customization used by Vietnam. The extra letters usually annotate some sort of weapon, sensor, or propulsion upgrade.

[bazillius 1,258]

11 hours ago, UllyB said:

only for a keen eye is a difference

Strange to hear it from person who see difference between F and F-13

PS without SMT the collection is not full

[+streakeagle 871]

There are a lot more variants than the "SMT" missing if you want a "full" collection.

List of Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 variants - Wikipedia

The SMT is a minor footnote in all of that history. SF2's stock install has quite the collection and with free user addons, I doubt any other sim will ever cover so many MiG-21 variants so well, despite any errors and/or omissions.

[UllyB 1,206]

4 hours ago, bazillius said:

Strange to hear it from person who see difference between F and F-13

PS without SMT the collection is not full

No, it was just a one time event, I assure you of that. I didn't know  until recently, when I was searching for something else and I bumped into an info which took me there. I discovered it accidentally that there is a slightly difference between them and I realized it only when I read about three guns instead of one. That was the spark when I realized they are indeed different. I didn't have pictures in my front, just letters in an article.

[bazillius 1,258]

3 hours ago, streakeagle said:

There are a lot more variants

Under collection i mean not every single aircrafts, i mean serial aircrafts. We MUST have SMT, my dear friends, what ever you say.

Edited April 6, 2021 by bazillius

[UllyB 1,206]

8 hours ago, bazillius said:

. We MUST have SMT, my dear friends, what ever you say.

Are you hitting on me ? :)))

[bazillius 1,258]

1 hour ago, UllyB said:

Are you hitting on me ? :)))

no. I'm just voicing a problem that has existed for a long time :)

[+Crusader 2,101]

We need
The Great Peoples of CombatAce Aeroplane Fanatics Committee for the Acquisition of the Awesome MiG-21SMT Fighter
aka
TGPoCAAFCftAotAM21SMTF

[Blade 353]

On 4/5/2021 at 9:30 PM, streakeagle said:

Among the Third Wire designations, the one reflecting the most confusion from my perspective is the MiG-21PFV. There was no MiG-21PFV. The Vietnamese flew the same export variants of the PF series flown by other clients. Russian sources don't note any special version with a "V" for Vietnam or some customization used by Vietnam. The extra letters usually annotate some sort of weapon, sensor, or propulsion upgrade.

Indeed, there was no 21PFV.

Edited April 6, 2021 by Blade

[UllyB 1,206]

20 hours ago, Blade said:

Indeed, there was no 21PFV.

MiG-21PFL (1966; Izdeliye 76A)L = Lokator ("Radar")

Version of MiG-21PF tailored to a Vietnamese requirement. The "L" designation may be short for lokator to reflect the different sensor suite in this version as compared to the standard PF.

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Mikoyan-Gurevich_MiG-21_variants

[+Gepard 11,295]

1 hour ago, UllyB said:

MiG-21PFL (1966; Izdeliye 76A)L = Lokator ("Radar")

Version of MiG-21PF tailored to a Vietnamese requirement. The "L" designation may be short for lokator to reflect the different sensor suite in this version as compared to the standard PF.

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Mikoyan-Gurevich_MiG-21_variants

I doubt that the L stands for Lokator. The P indicated already that it was a plane with radar. P stands for perekhvatchik = interceptor. F stands for Forsash = afterburner or increased power.

I think the L stands for Lokhki = light.

[+Gepard 11,295]

On 5.4.2021 at 12:09 AM, bazillius said:

 By the way, Will someone do MiG-21SMT? Or I have to model it by myself?

Its already available:

Its the stock MiG-21MF with SMT humpback added by fake pilot methode. Made by Spillone.

Edited April 7, 2021 by Gepard

[+yakarov79 11,085]

In fact, i have encountered only a few PFL designations in Russian books,  Mostly it is PF PFM PFS. Thing is that to identify correctly the type/subtype of the model we need to know factory designation. 

For example, MF is 96A but there is also MF out of factory designated in delivery documents as 96A00 - only that there are some differences in avionics and possibility to carry SPs-141Je in 96A00.  But sometimes the same model ordered by two countries but with different engines still had the same designation. 

And as was stated many times western designations and research of the topic - up to the mid-90s is a little bit messy.