chaff and flare

[bingo]

in WoV with phantom II 100% mnition and fuel, whwn release chaff/flare they there are not ban advise say they finished. Why? can someone help me?thanks

[Tannethal]

Depends on which model you fly, the stock WoV Phantoms don't have Chaffs or Flares. Not sure if the A7A/B has them, however some addon planes have them by default.

 

S!

[+BUFF]

Depends on which model you fly, the stock WoV Phantoms don't have Chaffs or Flares. Not sure if the A7A/B has them, however some addon planes have them by default.

In Vietnam virtually no aircraft had countermeasures.

It's very easy to add them if you want with a bit of .ini editing.

 

Use the search, Luke!

[csb]

Apparently, these were originally modelled for the sim, then before game release TK and his team found out the a/c at the time didn't have them. Thankfully we are still able to take advantage of their error. Thanks TK.

 

As Buff said, very easy to add c&f. See down below for required small edits you need to do.

 

I've added them to all my F4's and to Mirage, you can even decide how many to have.

 

In the MiddleEastWars campaign I added an Egyptian Airforce F-4E, with c&f (found an Egypt skin here(?)).

 

Very tough opponents and with radar guided missiles. Now I need to watch for incomng from all sides not just rear. Thanks to trusty RWR and my squadron "He's just fired a missile!"

 

But then a few issues arose:

 

Having a phantom as adversary with lots of c&f made it difficult to shoot down. So I changed the quantities of c&f to 8 of each, for all jets including own side. This keeps the challenge up without being to hard. Also with too many Chaff there was no reason to fly low in SAM territory.

 

Now it means I still need to use avoidance tactics; fly low, dodge, etc. I have too conserve my countermeasures.

 

With too many c&f I could just hit the dispense key any time so the challenge went right down.

 

I found this edit in a forum, maybe here. Copy it to a notepad.

 

. How To Add Chaff & Flares

 

. Add to end of sequence in [Fuselage] section take note to follow number sequence [0xx]

 

SystemName[0xx]=Flare_Station

SystemName[0xy]=Chaff_Station

 

 

 

. Add this after Weapon station section and before Fuel Tanks section, don't add bracket comments ( )

 

.(Phantoms)

 

 

[Flare_Station]

SystemType=DECOY_DISPENSER

EjectPosition= 2.052,0.959,-1.083

EjectVelocity=0.0,-5.0,-1.0

NumFlare=30

 

[Chaff_Station]

SystemType=DECOY_DISPENSER

EjectPosition= -2.052,0.959,-1.083

EjectVelocity=0.0,-5.0,-1.0

NumChaff=30

 

 

.(Mirage)

 

 

[Flare_Station]

SystemType=DECOY_DISPENSER

EjectPosition= 0.552,-3.000,-1.000

EjectVelocity=0.0,-5.0,-1.0

NumFlare=30

 

[Chaff_Station]

SystemType=DECOY_DISPENSER

EjectPosition= -0.552,-3.000,-1.000

EjectVelocity=0.0,-5.0,-1.0

NumChaff=30

 

 

. Change the Num to any quantity you like.

 

You can add to other types a/c by playing with the EjectPosition=x,y,z values.

 

x = -Left +right y = +forward -back z = +up -down Notice that -/+ values can be used.

Edited January 7, 2007 by csb

[+BUFF]

Apparently, these were originally modelled for the sim, then before game release TK and his team found out the a/c at the time didn't have them. Thankfully we are still able to take advantage of their error. Thanks TK

SF P1 came out considerably before WOV, set with more modern aircraft & didn't have countermeasures enabled.

There are lots of things that TK had obviously allowed for in the future in his original game engine design but hadn't then enabled support for (still true today e.g. brake 'chutes).

 

Given TK's background I think that it's highly likely that he knew from scratch that countermeasures were very rare in Vietnam.

[ezlead]

Go ahead and add chaff and flares to your Vietnam era aircraft.

Almost all attack and fighter aircraft operating during Linebacker 1 and 2 had flares and chaff to counteract the small handheld IR missiles and the SAMS.

They were either already on the aircraft or they were being retrofitted at Danang,Cubi Point or Thailand.

AN/ALE-29 or earlier variant.

We had flare dispensers on the EA-6A even with all the ECM gear,just in case.(They worked pretty well against the ATOLL)

Pop a couple of flares and break hard left or right.

One Marine F-4 driver popped a couple of flares at the last second and the missile just took off the left stabilator. He said it flew fine on just the right one. Good enough to get him back to Danang and land safely.

[+Crusader]

gread info ezlead, thanks. stuff like that, the small unknown little things which can't be found in any books are always interesting, and highly appreciated.

 

Thanks again :)

[+SayethWhaaaa]

Cheers CSB, just today I was wondering why my Chaff/Flares were only working with roughly half of my modded aircraft.

 

SystemName[0xx]=Flare_Station

SystemName[0xy]=Chaff_Station

 

This^^ was the crucial piece I was missing. You're a champ!

[csb]

Glad it helped. And thanks for feedback, one of my must do's.

 

And for anyone reading this, those two lines mentioned, SystemName=, can also be put at end of sequence of the [RightWing] and [LeftWing] sections. One wing gets flare and other gets chaff, doesn't matter which wing gets what.

 

So be aware if you looking in data.ini for these, it could be in wing sections or fuselage.

 

If your a/c ends up with bothit soesn't matter, it still works but you have double the amount.

 

So, how many c&f do you or anyone else put on their jets? I find 8 of each is plenty - due to reasons posted in my first reply.

[+SayethWhaaaa]

I find about 40 does the trick, but when I'm shot at, I release them in bursts of 8-10, sort of like the how Su-25 does... ...even then, I still get hit sometimes

[+Fubar512]

To the best of my knowledge, F-4 Phantoms in all three US services were not equipped with chaff or flares during the Vietnam war, although a few USAF Phantoms were set up as "Chaff Bombers", during the latter days of that conflict.

[csb]

Well, they should have, It's such an easy mod to do.

 

Maybe they didn't know about the SFP1 file extractor

 

SayWhat, do you have any enemy with c&f? Makes a difference if they have plenty of c&f - can't shoot 'em down, hardly.

 

I only have enemy Mirage & Phantoms with c&f.

 

Maybe later I'll give em to other enemy a/c.

 

But I was actually wondering about how/what to edit to make them not so reliable.

 

I know how to use weapon editor.

Edited January 7, 2007 by csb

[+SayethWhaaaa]

On average, most aircraft I've added into the game have 25+ chaff/flares which can be frustrating, especially since the J-7s I have in game give the impression that they have leading edge CM (countermeasure (oops, almost missed the "o" out )) technology

 

I used to find that before I started modding my aircraft that the AMRAAMs/AMRAAMski were pretty much a silver bullet at medium ranges but now, it takes me at least two at medium distances or a well timed shot near close range. The A.I. seems to release 3-4 cms in close succession when I fire active or semi-actives, IR sticks seem to be around 5 per shot.

 

I think if you want to make the missiles less susceptable to cms, make sure their noise rejection rating in the weapons editor is closer to 100% (although, I have a modded R-73 that I think has 99 or maybe 100 for that rating and it still gets spoofed!) OR drop the cms in the aircraft to 10 of each or something. I don't think there's a way to change the spoof rating on the cms.

 

How much of an effect does ECM have in-game? I've cranked the jammer rating on certain EW aircraft like the Prowler and it doesn't seem to make a difference, or none that I've seen anyhow...

Edited January 8, 2007 by SayWhat?!

[charlielima]

Good info. So Is thirty a fair quantity for flares and chaff for WOV era birds? :ph34r: CL

 

[+Dave]

To the best of my knowledge, F-4 Phantoms in all three US services were not equipped with chaff or flares during the Vietnam war, although a few USAF Phantoms were set up as "Chaff Bombers", during the latter days of that conflict.

 

 

As ezlead said most were added most were fitted with them as Cubi Point and Thailand. Linebacker II had many many aircraft fitted with them.