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MigBuster

F-18Fs for RAAF confirmed

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It would have taken some very rare circumstance for the SH order to be cancelled. However, I disagree with the comment that cancelling it would create tension between the Australian and US governments. The Australian-US alliance transcends any one decision. I sincerely doubt that cancelling one defence purchase would create tensions, especially when one takes into account sixty plus years of co-operation and friendship.

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It would have taken some very rare circumstance for the SH order to be cancelled. However, I disagree with the comment that cancelling it would create tension between the Australian and US governments. The Australian-US alliance transcends any one decision. I sincerely doubt that cancelling one defence purchase would create tensions, especially when one takes into account sixty plus years of co-operation and friendship.

 

To that I agree, the Super Hornet is a nice plane, but not the End All, Be All aircraft in the world.

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Hey, I was just wondering, Boeing should offer the Kittyhawk to Australia for its acquisition of Super Hornets, since India didn't want it nor them... :good:

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Hey, I was just wondering, Boeing should offer the Kittyhawk to Australia for its acquisition of Super Hornets, since India didn't want it nor them... :good:

Well, firstly it's not Boeing's to offer and secondly, the whole Kittyhawk to India thing was just an internet rumour,a senior US Navy officer came out and said that the Indian's hadn't approached them about selling it and they hadn't offered it. Besides, the RAN has a massive shortage of sailors at the moment, it can only put 5 out of six Collins Class SSGs to sea, so there's no way we could man a vessel as big as the Kittyhawk, not to mention that the costs of operating it would be needlessly excessive. I'm afraid the notion of Australia operating an aircraft carrier died with the HMAS Melbourne. Now, F-35Bs operating off the Canberra Class amphibious landing ship is another story... :nyam:

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That is, if the F-35B is ever going to be... Somehow I think that the F-35B, if not the entire F-35 project, may buy the farm, with all those cost overruns... :dntknw: Heck, if EADS had half a brain they'd come up with something along the light fighter (with stovl possibility) lines and steal the show from the F-35 (especially since it would also mean european jobs with localized production, and lack of barriers concerning technology exportation)...

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Yeah, even if EADS pulls something out, how they going to sell it? The Marines are crazy over it, so having them buy something that will replace the JSF is near verboten, so no, the US military is sold on JSF.

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Yeah, even if EADS pulls something out, how they going to sell it? The Marines are crazy over it, so having them buy something that will replace the JSF is near verboten, so no, the US military is sold on JSF.

 

 

If the air force can buy european tankers, why shouldn't the marines be able to buy a good european stovl fighter should it meet all its requirements? :blink:

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Uh... what European STOVL fighters? Harrier's no longer in production.

 

I find the idea of the RAN operating the Kitty kinda funny in that they'd have to increase the overall size of the Navy itself by about 20% and that'd be just for one ship! You're right though Pig, the time of the RAN Carrier has long since passed. Shame, would have been nice to at least have something like the Invincible... :cray:

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Uh... what European STOVL fighters? Harrier's no longer in production.

 

Re-read my above posts again - I stated that EADS should develop something new in the light fighter with stovl capability... I KNOW the Harrier is out of the window... Now it's time for EADS to build a worthy successor - good enough to beat the F-35! :clapping:

Edited by TX3RN0BILL

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Re-read my above posts again - I stated that EADS should develop something new in the light fighter with stovl capability... I KNOW the Harrier is out of the window... Now it's time for EADS to build a worthy successor - good enough to beat the F-35!

 

LOL! EADS would need at least a decade to come with a prototype for such an aircraft and in the end the completed design would cost twice as much as initally planned and would still have only half of the projected capabilities. Seriously.

Edited by Gocad

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LOL! EADS would need at least a decade to come with a prototype for such an aircraft and in the end the completed design would cost twice as much as initally planned and would still have only half of the projected capabilities. Seriously.

 

Well, I'm also counting on the new administration of the company being more efficient than the previous, so that such a morosity like the EF-2000 wouldn't happen again...

 

Maybe SAAB could produce such a fighter then? They don't have any STOVL experience yet but who knows, they're competent enough plane builders... :good:

 

Either SAAB or Yakovlev...

Edited by TX3RN0BILL

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You count far too high! Britain put its STOVL eggs in the JSF basket and that's that. The only other comparable naval-capable jets in production are the Russian MiG-29K, the Super Hornet (which is too big to be the entire fleet, why I skipped the Su-33 really), and the Rafale. The Rafale is the closest thing to the F-35 in size and it has failed to make a dent in the export market to date.

 

EADS will not make a STOVL or naval plane because quite frankly it would cost more than the Euro gov'ts want to pay (which is basically "as little as possible!") and they have no clear requirement for one. France got theirs. Italy, Spain, and the UK want F-35Bs, but they're not going to pay to build them on their own. They're still struggling to buy all the Typhoons they promised to! They won't have a chance of funding until after the last Typhoon is delivered and by then all the Harriers will have been long grounded.

 

SAAB might have been able to make a Gripen variant back when they started the program, but it's too late now and they're not likely to go down the naval/STOVL route.

 

Frankly, other than France hoping JSF implodes so they might sell some Rafales, no one wants JSF to fail because there's literally nothing else out there.

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Maybe something based on the Yak-141 Freestyle? With a renewed, less-edgy body, and western engine for those who want it... and other western technology... designed to fit the F-35's role... could prove to be a definite seller... :grin:

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I don't think that one's ready for primetime. It would still need years of development. Besides, other than STOVL and supersonic ability, it has none of the JSF's other features:

stealth (not ANY)

AESA

internal weapons bays (stealth and drag reduction)

carrier ability (you can carry more a farther distance compared to STOVL ops)

land-based practicality (wasted space for STOVL equipment limits range/payload)

integrated avionics to make the plane harder to kill and easier to make kills with

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That's why I said it needed a new body (something worthy of the 21st century with all that internal payload and stealth that is nowadays expected to be standard), new technology (avionics etc), and a western engine - it would be easier for Yakovlev to implement all that, rather than other companies trying their first hand at STOVL... That's why I thought Yakovlev has merit...

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You count far too high! Britain put its STOVL eggs in the JSF basket and that's that. The only other comparable naval-capable jets in production are the Russian MiG-29K, the Super Hornet (which is too big to be the entire fleet, why I skipped the Su-33 really), and the Rafale. The Rafale is the closest thing to the F-35 in size and it has failed to make a dent in the export market to date.

 

Well it's odd though, the French sent some down to Afghanistan awhile ago (forgot the time period) and Sweden is talking about the same thing supposedly, maybe to get their aircraft some combat use.

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:off_topic:

 

Aren't we getting a little off-topic here, Gentlemen? I don't see what aircraft carriers and a fictional European STOVL aircraft have to do with RAAF F-18Fs.

Sorry, but I just couldn't resist posting this:

 

post-2-1188366264-1.jpg

 

Perhaps it will help anybody who is planning an RAAF F/A-18F skin for the upcoming Super Hornet mod...hint, hint... :nyam:

Edited by PigDriver

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Once the template is done, like general lines. camo pattern, etc. I'll release a template :good: But then again it's easy enough.

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Well, even though the hornet is nothing special, and it'll be a step down from the F-111, it's probably a good choice for Australia. Athough I still don't like hornets.

 

At least you guys are getting NEW ones. We had to settle for a bunch of old beat-up F-18s handed down from the US NAVY because they were too old to land on carriers.

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Yeah but that's not just Canada or Australia anymore. OEF/OIF has been beating them up with all the landings and takeoffs they've been doing as well, and if I remember correctly, they've far or near exceeding the required number of landings that originally was called for. Reasons why the Marines are looking at the JSF so much, they're so old and beat up they need something new before they're stuff breaks. Remember Canucks don't have to slam their birds on a deck.

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Remember Canucks don't have to slam their birds on a deck.

 

Oh-ho, you didn't see the CF-188 that "landed" here last year! 4 Landings and an arrival. The pride of out airforce didn't flare and hit the runway going down 200 feet per minute! bounced like a Basketball! :haha::clapping:

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Sounds like the United Airlines flight I took from New York to Toronto in 2K6. The Captain's excuse was something like a sudden downdraft seconds before touchdown. Yeah... I believe it. :tongue:

 

Pigsy, is that a confirmed skin for the Superdud? I remember seeing something similar (almost identical) on the cover of the Oz Aviation mag a couple months back...

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