Sopwith Strutter 9700

[+whiteknight06604 934]

simply beautiful. It certainly is worth the wait.

[Hansa 12]

   

[+Stephen1918 1,474]

The level of detail is outstanding. Nice work!

[+sinbad 27]

Thanks.

 

According to my doctor my obsession with detail is uncureable . . .

[+whiteknight06604 934]

Thanks.

 

According to my doctor my obsession with detail is uncureable . . .

good for us bad for you ;)

[+Crusader 2,101]

Top work there sinbad

[Mike Dora 171]

Hi All

 

I may have missed something, but was this single-seat Strutter ever added to the download area?

 

Mike

[+sinbad 27]

Hi Mike-

 

No you didn't miss it, but the fact that you asked may have helped resurrect the project.

 

Reports of my demise are erroneous.

 

For about two years now, RL diverted me from important things - including the 9700, the U.S. Airco DH-4 w Marlin guns and related skins.

 

Both of these projects are now back on my desktop - thanks for the prod.

Now I need to remember what I forgot about 3D Max.

 

In addition to some more work on the mesh and the skins, both need some help with the FM's, especially the 9700 Strutter.

 

Actually the entire Strutter family of FM's needs some help, in part b/c they all had aboriginal flaps, in aprt because of the

slight dofferences between the British and the French builds.

 

The 9700, of course carried bombs, and the FM needs to be adjusted for the weight (and then the absence thereof).

Some 9700 pilots were eager to behave as though they were scout pilots when the bombs were gone.

The single place Strutter was then no longer easy meat.

 

Regards,

[+whiteknight06604 934]

this is great news. both that you are ok and that you might be finishing this project.

[+sinbad 27]

Thanks White Knight!

 

There will be a lot of slogging tho -

 

The disk and files settings on my new computer are different from those saved back in the paleolithic age when I put these projects on hold.

 

I need to reconfigure the 3dMax files before I can do anything.

[Mike Dora 171]

Glad you're back Sinbad, really glad you're re-inspired to carry on with your Strutter project.

 

I've been using a bodged 9400 Strutter model (from you and Dalgaith I think?) as a 9700 in my FE set-up, with the observer, Scarff ring and Lewis gun deleted but leaving that big hole behind the pilot. It would be really nice to have a proper 9700!

 

You comment "Some 9700 pilots were eager to behave as though they were scout pilots when the bombs were gone." Thinks: a single-seat Strutter reduced in dimensions and with twin instead of single Vickers guns might make quite a handy dogfighter. Maybe make the top wing straight to simplify production, and double the dihedral on the lower wing to compensate?

 

Cheers!

 

Mike

 

PS According to my references those moveable sections on the lower wing roots weren't actually "aboriginal flaps", they were a form of air brake. They flipped not down but up, at right angles to the airflow. Guess this implies the Strutter was quite a "slick" design for its day.

[+sinbad 27]

Hi Mike-

 

I guess the 9700 goes ahead of the DH-4, but both are on the desktop.

 

You are correct about the direction/mode of operation for the stub air brakes/flaps.

 

They were only marginally effective, and many pilots didn't like the "floating" effect they had.

Whatever the label, operation did make a difference,and while I once identified a way to incorporate the effect,

my fumbling with FM's is much more confused than my fumbling with 3dMax CS3.

When everything went on hold, I believe I was close to correctly modeling the operation, but not the FM effect.

 

I'm hoping that someone more proficient than I am can help with the FM, while I concentrate on getting the rust off the rest.

 

You are also correct about Dagaith; I came on board this project to help him as he was about to go into the army.

After I finished the 9400 and A2 models I totally lost contact. He should have finished his tour of duty by now.

 I hope he's OK and his absence is not combat related.

[+Stephen1918 1,474]

Welcome back Sinbad! I'm looking forward to your revised Strutter.

[+VonS 1,424]

Hi Mike-

 

No you didn't miss it, but the fact that you asked may have helped resurrect the project.

 

Reports of my demise are erroneous.

 

For about two years now, RL diverted me from important things - including the 9700, the U.S. Airco DH-4 w Marlin guns and related skins.

 

Both of these projects are now back on my desktop - thanks for the prod.

Now I need to remember what I forgot about 3D Max.

 

In addition to some more work on the mesh and the skins, both need some help with the FM's, especially the 9700 Strutter.

 

Actually the entire Strutter family of FM's needs some help, in part b/c they all had aboriginal flaps, in aprt because of the

slight dofferences between the British and the French builds.

 

The 9700, of course carried bombs, and the FM needs to be adjusted for the weight (and then the absence thereof).

Some 9700 pilots were eager to behave as though they were scout pilots when the bombs were gone.

The single place Strutter was then no longer easy meat.

 

Regards,

 

Great stuff, this is a beautiful looking, single-seater, "hybrid" dogfighter. Adjusting the FM for bomb weight should be easy enough in FE2 as I discovered with Geezer's Martinsydes that also had a dual-role (although those are not very effective as dogfighters). The trick is to test the aircraft first in something like "offensive" mode that doesn't give it bombs, tweak the FM to correct stats., and then to plug it into bombing mode or army coop - the top speed automatically goes down because of the addition of bombs. I look forward to tinkering with the FM once the project is released.

 

Happy flying,

Von S

[+sinbad 27]

Hi VonS

 

Thanks for the interest in the FM- Thats a releif as well as encouragement.

After all, if we cannot get realistic performance the modeling and skins are a waste of time and the A/C might as well look like a watermelon!

[Wilches 1,172]

How´s going? Any News?

[+sinbad 27]

Hi Wilches-

 

The Strutter project is moving but only glacially.

 

I began this project after assisting Dagaith before he went into the army. I then promised to finish the original work, and despite my fumbling with 3dMax, that was done.

When I attempted to resume work after RL intervened, I found that I needed to reinstall 3dMax 2009. Unfortunately that was is somewhat problematic, as the prior BAK version I had from years ago did not transfer (except for a limited period) to my new computer. I have not yet been able to locate a genuine copy of 3dMax 2009. As I understand it, Max 2009 is the only version that will transfer functional LODs to First Eagles. Autodesk no longer sells it and those I now find only pirated or copies available on line. I now have only a trial version that requires reconfiguration tweaking at each load. Combined with my feeble ability to recall and recover my previously limited skills, that makes it a slog to actually do anything.

 

The bottom line is that there is a WIP, but it will be a while before I make real progress. If I can locate, obtain and execute a valid install of a genuine copy of 3dMax 2009, that will be a real help.

 

My objectives include: mods to all versions for functional air brakes and fuel pumps, cellon overhead panels (all nearly done before the interregnum) and accurate horizontal stabilizers and windscreens for the French versions. I already have a package of skins, and a lot of research for more.

 

I am installing a new 2 TB Data drive today and that will help.

 

Thanks for your continuing interest.

 

[Crawford 570]

I also can't wait till it's release, sindbad. I've been looking forward to flying this bird.

I sincerely wish you success.

[+sinbad 27]

Hi Crawford-

 

THX- if it's good it isn't quick - unless Stephen1918 does it !

[Wilches 1,172]

Thanks sinbad for the response. Wish you all the best!

[+Geezer 3,569]

As I understand it, Max 2009 is the only version that will transfer functional LODs to First Eagles.

 

Yes...and no.  If you want to employ bump mapping or specular mapping, the answer is yes - you can only use Max 2009.  Absent those two features, most any version of Max will work.  For example, Stephen1918 uses Max R8 while I use Max R9.

 

One possibility: if you cannot locate Max 2009, you might possibly work out a deal with another modder who DOES have 2009.  You could get the model working ingame - except for bump or specular mapping - then pass it on the the Max 2009 guy and have him export a final 2009 LOD.

Edited July 16, 2016 by Geezer

[Guest]

Thanks for all the hard-work Sinbad. Looking through the screenies, it appears amazing! Really looking forward to it!!

[Guest]

Also, I'd be curious to know whether or not the plugins compatible with 3ds Max 2009 are also compatible with the freely available gmax; if so, it makes life much simpler, and if not already looked into, it ought to be.

[+Geezer 3,569]

Also, I'd be curious to know whether or not the plugins compatible with 3ds Max 2009 are also compatible with the freely available gmax; if so, it makes life much simpler, and if not already looked into, it ought to be.

 

Scroll down towards the bottom and you will find a VERY laborious procedure for loading a Max model into Gmax.  Note that Gmax was originally designed to ONLY export to CFS3, so going the other way - exporting a Gmax model to Max would be even more difficult.  There may now be a process to export Gmax files to programs other than CFS3, but I am not knowledgeable about Gmax so I can't help you there.

 

http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?92258-CFS3-modelling&p=1034153#post1034153

[Guest]

Scroll down towards the bottom and you will find a VERY laborious procedure for loading a Max model into Gmax.  Note that Gmax was originally designed to ONLY export to CFS3, so going the other way - exporting a Gmax model to Max would be even more difficult.  There may now be a process to export Gmax files to programs other than CFS3, but I am not knowledgeable about Gmax so I can't help you there.

 

http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?92258-CFS3-modelling&p=1034153#post1034153

Thanks! I am glad to know you are not departing from FE. Also Gmax comes on the CD of FS2004, and I believe it has been used to develop not only for CFS3 and FS2004 but also FSX. I was in actuality referring to whether or not someone had already tried inserting the TK's 3ds Max plugins into GMAX and exporting the FE lods via GMAX; per that sim-outhouse thread, some 3ds Max plugins are compatible with gmax, and I was wondering if that is or is not the case with TK's 3ds Max plugins.