Armed Observers for FE

[jeanba 1,915]

But the main point is that lot of archives were discovered since, dramatically changing the career of some planes such as the Letord, the Caudron G6/R4/R11

 

Interesting - thanks for the info.  Were those machines more widely used than previously thought?

 

F

Yes

For instance, the archive of C46 squadron one of the main Caudron R4 / Letord/ R11 user were discovered only few years ago.

And for the R11, for instance, they were intensively used for reconnaissance (especially under high threat) and escort. 

Only around 200 were used in combat but the number of missions they performed was very very high.

 

For G6 and R4, between 400 and 500 of each were used in combat between late 1916 and middle 1918 => quite a long time

Those planes are really neglected

 

Basically, most wwI french archives were lost in 1940, they were not destroyed as is often said, but they were confiscated by the German, then by the USSR in 1945.  They are now in Russia (where they were lost again but recovered few years ago)

Given the current relations between France and Russia, they are very difficult to recover.

 

For new french aircraft in FE2, I have no real choice. My position is "modders do what they want and can" but I will gladly participate to the vote.

Caudron G6/R4/R11 would be more original and would introduce new game play (unlike the Dorand, which is not "very different" from existing Sopwith Strutter, Spad XI ...)

R4 was in service for the longest period, R11 the most iconic, G6 the earliest (late 1916 / 1917)

Edited March 17, 2017 by jeanba

[+Geezer 3,569]

And for the R11, for instance, they were intensively used for reconnaissance (especially under high threat) and escort. 

Only around 200 were used in combat but the number of missions they performed was very very high.

 

 

The R11 is certainly a good looking beast.

 

Has anyone experimented with the formations .ini to create mixed formations?  The desired goal would be R11s and Brequets/Salmsons in one large formation.

[+Trotski 832]

I have wondered about the mixed squadrons question myself, I assumed it was not possible ......of course anything is possible, as long as the code is accessible. As for a vote on a 2 seater.....I would be happy with any, as I said before, there is room for Italian 2 seaters, along with the beautiful Albatros, I am glad I mentioned the Caudron and Letord , as it has obviously sparked a bit of intrest !!  ......so I am happy with whatever comes out of the hat to be frank........I just wish I had the capability to launch into the modelling side of things myself, but it is well out of my reach unfortunately.

hmmmm being a FEE gunner took a special kind of courage, at least in conventional 2 seaters, the poor gunner was at least supported a little, hanging on to that rear facing lewis, while the pilot was trying to jink around must have been........interesting. As if WWI aviation wasn't hard and dangerous enough !! 

[+gterl 1,204]

Bleriot XI

[+Trotski 832]

Oh for sure we so need a Bleriot , a Taube would be nice too, however I guess as they wern't in service overly long , these types have been passed over for the more glamorous and "fighty" aircraft...........Quick request to Stephen , I am currently re skinning the Fokker D II/ D III 's at the moment, and I was wondering if it would be possible to do a very small mod to the D II to make it into an Austrian B II one with no gun and one with a Swartzlose would be nice, the airframe is pretty much the same as the D II , and they would be a quick and dirty conversion job.

[+gterl 1,204]

[Wrench 9,426]

what about using the 'remove component' trick to eliminate the gun node? then, it's just an easy text edit to remove the gun from the data ini

as to the other one, that would need a new model

(trying to save Stephen some work!)

[+gterl 1,204]

what about using the 'remove component' trick to eliminate the gun node? then, it's just an easy text edit to remove the gun from the data ini

as to the other one, that would need a new model

(trying to save Stephen some work!)

..does that work for FE1/Gold too?

[Wrench 9,426]

I don't see why it wouldn't !! :)

 

easy to test (but I don't have those planes)

[+Trotski 832]

I'll give it a bash during the week, using the time tested trial and error method, as for the Swartzlose armed version, I suppose I could just rename the Spandau and use the Swartzlose config, in place of the LMG 08 one, it's just an idea anyhow, not a real important thing if its too big of a job.

It's a real shame that the guns arent a mountable item , like bombs or rockets, if that were the case swapping gun models would be an easy task, and folk wouldn't have to prat around with new LODs 

[Wrench 9,426]

sort of like the Lewis gun I added to the Tiger Moth, 8-9 years ago??? (read: gun pod, with the Lewis as the "shape")

[+Trotski 832]

yes a bit like that, no doubt some enterprising soul could do it, however in this case it wouldnt be possible as the Spandau is part of the LOD , so, as you said Stephen would have to re do the whole thing , probably not worth his time an effort, I shall attaempt to do the the remove node thing at some point and make it into an unarmed version. As it wasn't that common an aircraft , it isn't that important, Unless Stephen would like to do it of course, then I wont complain lol

[+Stephen1918 1,473]

Trotski00 - I have an M7/B.I in the download section. It's very similar to the M10E/B.II (with single bay wings) and it is unarmed. Bortdafarm has a B.I with two bay wings, so it's similar to the M10Z/B.II. Maybe those will work for you?

 

Gterl - The "remove component trick" does work in FE1/Gold. I learned about it in the SF forums (which uses the same game engine as FE.) Search on Combat Ace for "remove component trick" and you'll find several threads that mention it.

[+VonS 1,423]

Hi Trotski,

 

Bortdafarm also has a single-bay Fokker B.II (the one used by the Austrians on the Italian front, and to a lesser extent on the Eastern front), but I recommend my FM tweak for the type - located in the ver. 8.0 update folder under the Italian and Eastern theaters - otherwise the type is impossible to fly in FE2...it was historically more difficult to fly than the D.II single-seater that the Germans preferred...two bay or not two bay, that is the question   - here's the link to Bortdafarm's model:

 

http://combatace.com/files/file/4643-fokkerbii/

 

Happy flying,

Von S

[+Trotski 832]

Yes Stephen I do indeed have your lovely M17 , I wasn't aware of Bort doing a BII though, and it is the single bay jobs I am looking for , my intrest was piqued when I was researching D II & D III skins , the special hobby 1/48 kit of the B II popped up, and I was intrested in the CDL scheme for it, unfortunately it appears to be the Swartzlose armed version, hence my request. 

 

Von S, I use your FM's all the time, as a matter of course, and as such have them all, and I ad them to each aircraft as I skin it , wouldn't shop anywhere else mate !! 

 

I shall take a peek at the Bort B II however I feel it is most likely not up to scratch anymore, and as the aircraft type wasn't that common, I may just have to pass on it, as I said it is a whim, it would be nice to have one though with the squared off rudder, instead of the normal Fokker Comma.

also Bort's Model seems to have twin Spandaus, which really isn't what I was looking for as a single Swartzlose was the actual armament, when they were armed that is.

[+Trotski 832]

M17 ?....surely I meant M7......fingers getting ahead of themselves again.....so situation normal then !! 

[+VonS 1,423]

Hello Gents,

 

As a followup to the suggestions here, particularly Whiteknight's beautiful "hack and slash" mod - can now confirm that it works wonderfully. Rifle-armed observers now take occasional shots at me. I was also inspired by the "early" Parasol L (two-seater) that Whiteknight included in his package - so I've now tweaked the FM for it (will include this with a ver. 8.9 update of the FM pack...but here it is already for your flying pleasure).

 

Make a copy of your Morane LAO folder (two-seater with Lewis gun up front and another for the observer), rename the folder to MSTypeLAOe, and copy over the four files from my folder with the same name, into yours (you may also delete the old general ini file, data ini, and the hangar and loading files from the folder that you duplicated and renamed as indicated).

 

Stats. for the early Morane L (two-seater):

 

top speed 112 kph

take offs are best around 90 kph

climbs best between 85 and 95 kph at about 2.5 m/s

stalls if climbing at less than 80 kph

also about 10kg lighter than the later, armed version

slightly lower ceiling and MaxG rating for it than on LAO type

 

Don't forget to install Stephen1918's pilots and also his rifle-armed observers, into your Pilots folder, for everything to work.

 

Here are a couple of pics of me trailing the Parasol, and then getting some rifle-damage to my wing. The rifle blast emanates from the observer's head   but I like it. Wish I was able to take a snapshot of that.

 

 

 

 

 

And the early Parasol Type L (two-seater):

 

 

 

Happy flying,

Von S

 

P.S. To use this "unarmed" type on the Eastern front, change service dates from about Oct. of 1914 to June/July of 1915 (educated guess).

Edited March 27, 2017 by VonS

[+VonS 1,423]

For an even more aggressive observer with a rifle, go under the "// Crew -----" section of the data ini for the early Parasol (posted above), and under [Gunner] paste in the following info., overriding the previous, relevant entries:

 

PitchAngleRate=40

MaxPitch=70

MinPitch=-30

DefaultPitchAngle=5

YawLimited=TRUE

YawAngleRate=15

 

This gives more frequent shots, and deflection shots too - I got a little too close and then this happened.

 

 

 

Happy flying,

Von S

[+Geezer 3,569]

yes a bit like that, no doubt some enterprising soul could do it, however in this case it wouldnt be possible as the Spandau is part of the LOD , so, as you said Stephen would have to re do the whole thing , probably not worth his time an effort, I shall attaempt to do the the remove node thing at some point and make it into an unarmed version. As it wasn't that common an aircraft , it isn't that important, Unless Stephen would like to do it of course, then I wont complain lol

 

I finally found my old back-up disc with the Junkers J.1 that Quack74 likes - I'll slowly rework it to bring it up to current standards.  The same disc also has Spandau, Parabellum, and Lewis guns so I could also release the guns as separate LODs.  However, substituting different guns will only work if the original gun can first be deleted in MUE's LOD viewer.  Is this possible?

Edited March 29, 2017 by Geezer

[+gterl 1,204]

You can't change LOD files (..well at least legally). BUT you can 'hide' certain parts with INI tweaks.

And the LOD viewer is ..a viewer

Love the Junkers...which is actually a J.4 (factory designation)...J.1 was the military designation...release date? ...LOL

Edited March 29, 2017 by gterl

[+whiteknight06604 931]

I always loved that Morane-Saulnier

[+Geezer 3,569]

You can't change LOD files (..well at least legally). BUT you can 'hide' certain parts with INI tweaks.

And the LOD viewer is ..a viewer

Love the Junkers...which is actually a J.4 (factory designation)...J.1 was the military designation...release date? ...LOL

 Thanks, now I know - if you spend your time making models there is little time to mess around with files.

 

I have several irons in the fire - buildings, CR32, SM79 - but I intend to work on the J.1 whenever I need a break. 

I always loved that Morane-Saulnier

The Type P replaced the earlier M-S parasols, that are available in the downloads, and soldiered on in French observation squadrons until finally being replaced in late 1917.  While France produced some excellent two-seater designs, production schedules always fell behind so the Brequets, Salmsons, etc were not available in large numbers until late 1917.

[+Trotski 832]

Ooooh more goodies for me to try out, By the way Geezer, how dificult would it be for you to do a Halberstadt DII version of your D 5 ? I know there are versions of it available from the site that I shall not mention by name , as it will lead me to the irresistable urge to throw insults, and also the one Bort did, however, neither is really either accurate, or in the case of Borts, really up to speed for FE2 I know there were few differenced between the DIII and the D 5 , however the DII have a different exhaust system, and I believe the wing form is a little different as well,  As for the Arse teams version, what the heck is going on with that ammunition feed !! 

[+Geezer 3,569]

Ooooh more goodies for me to try out, By the way Geezer, how dificult would it be for you to do a Halberstadt DII version of your D 5 ? I know there are versions of it available from the site that I shall not mention by name , as it will lead me to the irresistable urge to throw insults, and also the one Bort did, however, neither is really either accurate, or in the case of Borts, really up to speed for FE2 I know there were few differenced between the DIII and the D 5 , however the DII have a different exhaust system, and I believe the wing form is a little different as well,  As for the Arse teams version, what the heck is going on with that ammunition feed !! 

 

Nope, I don't have enough time to do my own stuff, let alone duplicate someone else's stuff.

[+Trotski 832]

I suppose we could "pretend" your D 5 is a D II maybe just alter the Engine specs to reflect an earlier machine ? It's just a thought by the way, not expecting you to jump in on it , sorry if you thought that, was just wondering if you could do a new lod....but if you haven't got the time, which I know you don't , it isn't a big deal. it would be nice to have a DII/III with the exhaust stack coming out the top of the engine........Like I say, I am unable to attempt anything like this anyhow, as I dont have access to 3DS Max, and also I wouldnt even begin to know where to start !! I for one appreciate the wonderful models you personally produce, and I only wish I had half your ability !! 

I know I keep coming up with bright spark ideas, i'm just enthusiastic, please donn't think I am being pushy or demanding, as that is not my intent.