Adding Missle Rails

[CSomers611]

I'm tinkering around with a couple of F-4 Phantom "What-If" versions.

One being the F-4EX Interceptor and as such I've added additional AIM-7 "hard points" to the wings. Note: I plan on removing them from the inside pylons, make this AIM-9 only.

My question is, how do I add missile pylons to the outside hard points for the AIM-7's?

[yakarov79]

You need to have the pylon model itself, then via ini work and adding extra weapon stations in data ini..you will be done.

[Wrench]

Doesn't the ground crew just bolt them on???

 

I'll show myself out now ......................................................

[Wrench]

The pylons, when made as an additional item, can be added via the 'fake pilot' method. I've had to do this for several WW2 aircraft that the original modeler didn't build them in. It's not difficult, what with the LOD Viewer (all blessing to Mue!!!), not like what it was 'way back then. You can get the pylon's "place in the world" pretty close, but still will have to check in game for where it really shows up, as it's a "pilot seat". There IS some guesswork, of course, as in positioning launch rails on the pylon (seat)

We also have a 'dual rack' for Sparrow/AMRAAM around here somewhere too.

If you really want to go crazy with Sidewinders, try the "Christmas Tree" HVAR rack used on the P-38J Lightnings!!!

[daddyairplanes]

somewhere on site or on his drives, i'll bet @ravenclaw_007 has what youre looking for all ready set up.

historical nitpick: Sparrows would have been too big and heavy to double up like that. the Navy mounted them on the inboard pylons once in a blue moon (sans Winders) but i dont think the USAF ever did with their style pylons. BUT......

the Shrike was made from the Sparrow body, so singular Sparrows should be able to mount on with the ARM pylon rail (possibly already on the model)

could give a best load out of 7 Sparrows and 4 Winders (plus ECM and centerline tank)

Edited Tuesday at 07:06 PM by daddyairplanes

[CSomers611]

3 hours ago, daddyairplanes said:

historical nitpick: Sparrows would have been too big and heavy to double up like that. the Navy mounted them on the inboard pylons once in a blue moon (sans Winders) but i dont think the USAF ever did with their style pylons. BUT......

the Shrike was made from the Sparrow body, so singular Sparrows should be able to mount on with the ARM pylon rail (possibly already on the model)

could give a best load out of 7 Sparrows and 4 Winders (plus ECM and centerline tank)

I was just tinkering to see if I knew how to add missiles and surprised myself! Was planning on tweaking it to make it more "historically" accurate when I figured out launchers.

4 hours ago, Wrench said:

The pylons, when made as an additional item, can be added via the 'fake pilot' method. I've had to do this for several WW2 aircraft that the original modeler didn't build them in. It's not difficult, what with the LOD Viewer (all blessing to Mue!!!), not like what it was 'way back then. You can get the pylon's "place in the world" pretty close, but still will have to check in game for where it really shows up, as it's a "pilot seat". There IS some guesswork, of course, as in positioning launch rails on the pylon (seat)

We also have a 'dual rack' for Sparrow/AMRAAM around here somewhere too.

ah, the 'fake" pilot trick! Question on this, will these "fake pilot" pylons show up even when not loaded? Can they be jettisoned?

I need to find that Sparrow dual rack.... 

Edited Tuesday at 10:20 PM by CSomers611

[daddyairplanes]

2 minutes ago, CSomers611 said:

ah, the 'fake" pilot trick! Question on this, will these "fake pilot" pylons show up even when not loaded? Can they be jettisoned?

yes to the first, no to the second

[yakarov79]

if you make them as fake pilot...rails will be permanently loaded on a wing - fake pilot is literally fake pilot or fake seat...- so as long as you are flying....it will be there..and even on the flighline, fake pilot mod is still present on aircraft. But  I would recommend adding them as loadable in the loadout menu - fake ECM pods, dummy tanks....this way can be jettisoned. Or missile launchers - although SAHM/AHM have dedicated launchers? Or I don't remember anymore....

[CSomers611]

4 hours ago, daddyairplanes said:

historical nitpick: Sparrows would have been too big and heavy to double up like that. the Navy mounted them on the inboard pylons once in a blue moon (sans Winders) but i dont think the USAF ever did with their style pylons. BUT......

the Shrike was made from the Sparrow body, so singular Sparrows should be able to mount on with the ARM pylon rail (possibly already on the model)

could give a best load out of 7 Sparrows and 4 Winders (plus ECM and centerline tank)

Keeping what you said in mind I created (2) Air-to-Air Loadouts.

All AIM-7's totaling 8.

Uses the ARM loadout points and launchers......

 

The other is a mixture of AIM-7 and AIM-9's.

This loadout has (6) AIM-7's & (4) AIM-9's.

[Wrench]

You REALLY want to keep those short range missiles, trust me!!

[alfa2]

4 hours ago, Wrench said:

You REALLY want to keep those short range missiles, trust me!!

As Wrench said AIM-9's had always a much higher Pk and especially in the days of the F-4's you couldn't think being left without them. The Sparrows, especially the early days Echo versions weren't so much longer range capable compared to the Sidewinders of the second generation (-9J' and on) and were more restrictive in their employment. To clarify, since you were obliged to guide the Sparrow till its impact we were getting into the kill zone of the enemy's short range missiles or the launch range of your fire and forget AIM-9's. The Sparrow's advantage was its "all weather" useability and the head-on employment capability. Once the L's and P-4's came into play, the Sparrows have lost the second advantage.

Edited Wednesday at 10:11 AM by alfa2

[CSomers611]

3 hours ago, alfa2 said:

As Wrench said AIM-9's had always a much higher Pk and especially in the days of the F-4's you couldn't think being left without them. The Sparrows, especially the early days Echo versions weren't so much longer range capable compared to the Sidewinders of the second generation (-9J' and on) and were more restrictive in their employment. To clarify, since you were obliged to guide the Sparrow till its impact we were getting into the kill zone of the enemy's short range missiles or the launch range of your fire and forget AIM-9's. The Sparrow's advantage was its "all weather" useability and the head-on employment capability. Once the L's and P-4's came into play, the Sparrows have lost the second advantage.

As both you and @Wrench pointed out, I agree. Was trying to think of what the F-4EX would've have carried as an Interceptor and looking at other aircraft in this role of the time period....many did not have AIM-9's. Which is why I made it a loadout option to try to mirror it. I like have Sidewinders for the very reasons mentioned.

[CSomers611]

Here's another loadout option.....

[yakarov79]

if this is waht if...give them some satellite killer...

[CSomers611]

55 minutes ago, yakarov79 said:

if this is waht if...give them some satellite killer...

I've thought about that....recommendations for this?

Edited Wednesday at 03:27 PM by CSomers611

[Flanker562]

I think there's an ASAT mod (I think it's in 1st Gen) in the SF1 section, by FastCargo. It even includes a satellite to shoot at.

[daddyairplanes]

2 hours ago, CSomers611 said:

 

Here's another loadout option.....

are those Nuclear Falcons?

has NightshadeP/R kidnapped you? nuke two bears for yes......

[CSomers611]

1 hour ago, daddyairplanes said:

are those Nuclear Falcons?

has NightshadeP/R kidnapped you? nuke two bears for yes......

Those are Nuclear Falcons....thought about @Nightshade/PR when I did it!