BVR Kills

[Anthony W.]

Okay, in WoV and WoE there are missiles designed to fire from 30 miles away, so what do I have to do to be able to get a lock at that range other than pointing at the target?

[Sakai]

In the search mode of your radar, extend out to as far is the bad guy is away from you. Then acquire the target. Then lock it. All of these keys are in the controls section. Personally, I have them mapped to the base of my logitec extremem 3D pro, makes it easy. After the target it locked you will get the yellow diamond, then fire. Sounds to me that your using boresite mode to lock onto enemy planes, I did that too for like a year till I figured it out. Hope this helps.

 

 

 

Tom

[Anthony W.]

In the search mode of your radar, extend out to as far is the bad guy is away from you. Then acquire the target. Then lock it. All of these keys are in the controls section. Personally, I have them mapped to the base of my logitec extremem 3D pro, makes it easy. After the target it locked you will get the yellow diamond, then fire. Sounds to me that your using boresite mode to lock onto enemy planes, I did that too for like a year till I figured it out. Hope this helps.

 

 

 

Tom

 

I'm not that dumb, my problem is that it refuses to lock up.

[+Spectre_USA]

I'm not that dumb?

 

What a fine kick in the crotch for a guy trying to help you out.

 

Sometimes they won't lock up due to angle off, relative heading, altitude (especially if below you), etc.

 

Until you get the yellow diamond, you aren't locked, and SAHM nor AHM's will fire...

[Rodent]

Are you getting a little box moving between the blips on the radar? Some radar ranges may not let you lock a target but you have to set a shorter search range.

[zmatt]

In the search mode of your radar, extend out to as far is the bad guy is away from you. Then acquire the target. Then lock it. All of these keys are in the controls section. Personally, I have them mapped to the base of my logitec extremem 3D pro, makes it easy. After the target it locked you will get the yellow diamond, then fire. Sounds to me that your using boresite mode to lock onto enemy planes, I did that too for like a year till I figured it out. Hope this helps.

 

 

 

Tom

 

Wait, you can lock on with search mode? This has never worked for me. How do you do that?

[johnrey]

Just use the F-22 and the F-35.They lock on easily on a front cockpit view.(Well that's just my experience.)

[+Wrench]

Wait, you can lock on with search mode? This has never worked for me. How do you do that?

YGTBSM!!!!

 

How do you think you get from seeing all the blips to locking a single target???

 

Ok, say we're mosying along a 22k feet, in our handy dandy F-4E. Simply because I really like Rhino...and it's aviionics are relatively simple.

 

Our radar, set to SEARCH, it reaching out 50 miles. It detects a close-packed bunch of blips at around 40 miles. Now, we can't use our handy dandy insert/home keys to lock a suspected target, as we're out of range (and this is determined in EACH aircrafts avionics ini -- if you study them, you'll see what I mean), and is probably linked to the missile's weapons data. And, of course, in the avionics60.dll, in this case...

 

So, we close to less than 25 miles, dropping the range gate as we go. At 20 miles more or less, we can now select a target to lock with the home/insert/whichever key. You might have to 'jump' between each blip, until you get (again, more or less) the lead unit. HOME should lock him, and your display will automatically switch to something close to boresight; the single verticle line, and the range gate circle and your target a largish blip along the V line. Keeping you nose pointed directly at the target by flying directly towards it; ie manuver to keep the pipper centered, you watch for the "InRange" light on the instrument panel. Personally, with Sparrows, I don't fire until they're less than 10 miles out. Better chance of a hit.

Press that button ...and wait for the fireworks. Don't forget the Sparrow is semi-active, so you'll need to keep the nose pointed at the target, so the seeker head "sees" the reflected radar energy from said target.

Don't forget to inform your wingmate to engage, too....

 

Seriously, for all you....RTFM!!! It's all covered in there (well, at least in MY copies of SF/WoV/WoE). A little research on the weapons systems and how THEY work wouldn't be a bad idea, either.

Just a suggestion, of course.

 

Wrench

kevin stein

[zmatt]

Sorry, I have just been using the Boresight/Air Combat mode to engage targets. Whenever I got into range to fire missiles I always switched over to those.

[+Spectre_USA]

They rarely travel solo, so it is best to engage as many as possible before getting into boresight range, if possible.

 

Things can happen pretty quick inside boresight range, and I'd rath have a nimble heater ready to rock than a clumsy Sparrow, ya know?

[zmatt]

^ good point. Although I find that at least in my experience the early sparrows tend to hit their targets more often than the early sidewinders.

 

I flew an intercept mission with the F4-E and tried using search mode. It worked but I found that once you get within 10nm search really doesn't lock on that much and you have to switch to boresight. Is that standard procedure?

[+EricJ]

They rarely travel solo, so it is best to engage as many as possible before getting into boresight range, if possible.

 

Things can happen pretty quick inside boresight range, and I'd rath have a nimble heater ready to rock than a clumsy Sparrow, ya know?

 

Which is why when I'm rolling in mountainous regions, I carry 'winders because it takes too long for AHM/SAHM engagement. Matter of fact I got bounced by four Flankers, got two of them, (I only knew they were after me because I was going for a reattack and heard the loud engine noise of it fly by. Then I fired, splashed one, wheeled around, splashed another, then boogie'd out of there, managed to smack one on the side of a mountain, and I just hit the border and he turned away.

[+Spectre_USA]

Yeah, those are the types of engagements I like!

 

Too bad we don't get credit for maneuver kills. Those are my favorite kind!

 

[Anthony W.]

I'm not that dumb, my problem is that it refuses to lock up.

 

 

I'm sorry that sounded offensive... I have disthymic personality disorder, it causes me to make comments that I don't regard or mean to be offensive yet tend to offend... Nothing serious, it just means I tend to make rude comments that aren't meant to be rude... I do thank you all for any help I get... Whether I understand it or not... Its the thought that counts I suppose...

[gbnavy61]

^ good point. Although I find that at least in my experience the early sparrows tend to hit their targets more often than the early sidewinders.

 

I flew an intercept mission with the F4-E and tried using search mode. It worked but I found that once you get within 10nm search really doesn't lock on that much and you have to switch to boresight. Is that standard procedure?

 

Agree on the Sparrows/Sidewinders. Also agree w/ Spectre. I try get all my Sparrows off the rails and into the bad guys before we merge - mostly due to the low reliability of the early Sidewinders. After that, it's harder to get a good shot for the Sparrow, so you are better off taking a chance with the Sidewinders, but then you're really taking a chance.

 

zmatt, yeah inside 10 miles it's too much hassle to work the search mode and try to pick out a specific target, generally. If you're really in a helluva dogfight, you won't get enough time w/ your nose pointed one way to get a paint on a target, then lock it up. Better off w/ boresight/ACM mode.

[zmatt]

ok so really the only thing I was doing wrong was trying to use Boresight mode at bvr ranges.

[Sakai]

ok so really the only thing I was doing wrong was trying to use Boresight mode at bvr ranges.

 

pretty much, boresight is limited in range, azimuth, etc. Search mode changes to aquisition mode when you lock onto a target. I learned the technique flying rhinos, and it seems to work well enough in any other aircraft.

[Ronbo]

This is a good post. It should be a sticky with more indepth if possible by the 'old hands' with this series. Some of you old hands need to remember, not all of us are experts on jet combat. Im new to jet combat, as Im more of the visual guns. My books are 10k miles away, so i cant read up on some of the stuff i have.

 

Im with one of the other posters, when i tried reading the manual, and applying it (WoV), i couldnt get the radar to help me as by the time i got blips, it was just better to go to boresight. with my modern fighters added to SF1, F-15/16 to MiG29, BVR is much more possible.

 

So, any hints or tips would be appreciated and should be stickied so we 'newbs' dont keep asking. And yes, ive read the manual.

[Romflyer]

I have to agree that the manual is a little less than........thorough one thing that I found helpful was I downloaded Bunyap's the 'Range' http://forum.combatace.com/index.php?autoc...p;showfile=2658 it's a great place to go and practice, and there is a pretty good tutorial (with pictures) on using radar.

Edited January 19, 2009 by romflyer

[Stick]

Suprising nobody mentioned the F-14A Tomcat.Light up targets on the TWS-1 out of 4 phoenixes ought to bag the bad guys on the worst of days.And with the new cockpit the old Tomcat is still among my favourites.

[Anthony W.]

I have to agree that the manual is a little less than........thorough one thing that I found helpful was I downloaded Bunyap's the 'Range' http://forum.combatace.com/index.php?autoc...p;showfile=2658 it's a great place to go and practice, and there is a pretty good tutorial (with pictures) on using radar.

 

Totally... I read it somewhere around 3 times and was thinking "But this still doesn't answer my question..."

[+Fubar512]

Totally... I read it somewhere around 3 times and was thinking "But this still doesn't answer my question..."

 

 

Wrench answered your question. And, only a select few missiles are capable of a 30 nm acquistion range, and that's assuming that your radar isn't being jammed by your intended target.

[Viper6]

Wrench answered your question. And, only a select few missiles are capable of a 30 nm acquistion range, and that's assuming that your radar isn't being jammed by your intended target.

Agreed, knowing your weapons capabilities really helps in how you engage. Edited January 21, 2009 by Viper6

[gbnavy61]

It's probably also worth mentioning a few things that play into a long-range BVR shoot. Obviously, the goal is to kill the other guy, so the thing is to give yourself the best chance of doing that.

 

- Is the target coming or going? If he's headed away from you, unless you've got some monster closure on him, it will likely be easy for him to outrun your missile (assuming he becomes aware of it). If you're closing head-on, you're in good shape. Not only is the missile going to speed off towards him, but he's doing part of the work by flying at the missile.

 

- Is he above or below you? There's things to consider with both. If he's above you, that's good because the radar can pick him out against a clear sky very easily. However, your missile also has to climb uphill to get him and use energy to climb that could later be used to maneuver for a kill. On the other hand, if he's below you it will be harder to pick him out of the ground clutter and you might lose the lock - bad for Sparrows. The upside is, though that the missile can use gravity to help it go downhill, saving a little energy to maneuver. The best mix would probably to be no more than 5K below the target. The missile probably won't lose a whole lot of energy climbing a few thousand feet, but you still give your radar a better chance of keeping lock on the bad guy.

 

- How fast are you going? The faster, the better, at launch - your missile starts off at the same speed as your aircraft and then accelerates a couple Mach above that speed. The more kinetic energy the missile has at the start of its life, the harder it will be for your target to bleed it out of energy. After you shoot, however, you may consider slowing down to prevent yourself from rushing into the bad guy's missile envelope unnecessarily.

Edited January 22, 2009 by gbnavy61

[Rodent]

And of course keep in mind if the missile you just fired is fire and forget or if you need to keep radar lock on your target until it hits. Made the mistake myself of firing a missile and then going back to search mode before the missile hit and then it just stops tracking and dies.