Add Anything To a Ship

[+EricJ 3,944]

Aren't carriers invincible anyways?

[+Old Diego 66]

Not completely invincible, they can eventually be destroyed.

[+EricJ 3,944]

Fair enough but I personally (maybe I've never flown a campaign) they've actually attacked the ship to really worry about it, but hey something to account for I guess....

[+Old Diego 66]

I guess if you're flying an Argentine A-4 against a British task force, the ability to sink a carrier might come in handy but I know what you mean about the invincibility - the carrier might as well be solid ground. I want as much info out there so that people know up front what to expect from each method.

[+malibu43 142]

Hey guys,

 

I, for one, am very interested. Unfortunately, I'm limited to .ini editing only, so this isn't something I can really contribute to.

 

But by all means, keep working on it! I will definitely add populated aircraft carriers and/or carriers with battle groups around them to my Vietnam campaigns the second they're available!

[FastCargo 412]

Some more experimenting after Vampyre gave us some great info...

 

 

The diagram of the Nimitz I have isn't quite perfect, so there are a few minor mismatches. But you can see, a concurrent ops flight deck is busy looking, even at this early stage.

 

FC

[+allenjb42 4,130]

Looks great FC.

 

Presumably you could also do a 1980s deck with F-14, A-6, EA-6B & A-7, and a 1990s deck with F-14, F\A-18, EA-6B & A-6 too? E-2, SH-3 & SH-60 are DAT models only at present so they couldn't be included, but maybe the S-3 could be added too? Does the model have folded wings?

[+Sundowner 4,516]

Personally I think its a great idea, I hate the boring lifeless stock carriers but at the moment I dont have a lot of time to try it out myself.

 

I also can't help wondering if all your time and hard work could be in vain once this Tomcat thingie gets released, although I would'nt hold my breath.

[FastCargo 412]

I was wondering that myself. Because TK himself has said that the Tomcat sim will include naval combat, I would assume a few things:

 

1) Carriers will be reasonably destroyable vs needing stupid amounts of firepower, which means the Flight deck issue will need resolution.

2) Weapons may need to be targetable...I believe one of the things the F-14 was to do for fleet defense was kill cruise missiles.

3) Carriers will need to have usable, multilayered defenses.

 

Reason 1 is almost certain, reasons 2 and 3 may not happen.

 

How TK changes the carriers will certainly affect how this is done in the future. If carrier defense weapons become relevant, the 'weapon' method won't be useful...UNLESS TK allows multiple types of weapons on a single ship.

 

Also, TK could change the coding for carriers to treat them more like airbases with 'parking spots'...that certainly would be a cheap way to populate a carrier deck if you put strict limits on width and length of aircraft (note the parameters exist in the data.ini of the aircraft in question).

 

FC

[FastCargo 412]

Looks great FC.

 

Presumably you could also do a 1980s deck with F-14, A-6, EA-6B & A-7, and a 1990s deck with F-14, F\A-18, EA-6B & A-6 too? E-2, SH-3 & SH-60 are DAT models only at present so they couldn't be included, but maybe the S-3 could be added too? Does the model have folded wings?

 

The problem with other decks is the MAX models are needed to 'build' the deck. Until you have MAX models available for those items, building remains limited.

 

That being said, I just found a nicer EA-6B model for free, and I think Skatezilla put out a version of his carrier that already has a Hawkeye model on it...

 

FC

[Canadair 16]

I think this is VERY intersting. Me likes the idea a lot.

And I guess the weapon method is the way to go. Would be awesome to see populated carriers. Also, honestly ship combat is not that great, Most carriers weapons are to defend from missiles and not from other a/Cs anyway, and this is impossible in the came. Also I think that it is not necessary to use a full carrier layout, few planes would give some snse of imemrsion bu t retain the practical use of one model for recovery and launch

[FastCargo 412]

And for those with images of 'teh sex plane' in their heads...

 

 

 

FC

[+Dave 2,318]

That gives me a woodrow....

[+whiteknight06604 931]

It never ceases to amaze me what you guys come up with.Thanks for doing all this work.

[FastCargo 412]

Well, I'm going to hold on the project temporarily until TK can answer just a few questions I have about the Tomcat sim regarding the carriers. But I have been finding more and more models to import into the project, so filling the deck won't be an issue. Remapping on the other hand...

 

FC

[FastCargo 412]

Okay, according to TK on the TW website, because most of the time and money seems to be going into the Tomcat and new terrain engine (!), there doesn't seem like there will be significant changes to the carrier side of things. He hasn't even confirmed a new Nimitz class carrier (I would think that would be a given)...but I am going to assume there will be one closely sized with Skatezilla's version.

 

So, to narrow down the parameters of the project:

 

A Nimitz carrier as a base.

A flight deck running concurrent ops (not completely realistic, but allows use in campaigns).

Deck will have aircraft, GSE, personnel, maybe some weapon carts.

 

From what I can tell, the GSE and personnel shapes haven't changed that much since the late 70s, so those will stay constant.

 

The question is what aircraft for what time periods.

 

Here are the aircraft I have MAX files for so far (some were native, some I had to convert from other sources):

 

F-14A

FA-18A

FA-18E/F/G

EA-6B

A-6

E-2

F-35C

 

I am in the process of evaluating a few other models, including an A-7 and SH-60 from Sketchup to MAX.

 

I haven't found a decent Hoover or Sea King model yet, they may not be included.

 

My question to folks in the know is how many different variants of the flight deck should be made and which aircraft for which variant. Keep it simple, remember that nothing will be moving. Also, this will only encompass the Nimitz class carriers, and minor model differences (ie FA-18A vs FA-18C) won't be broken out...this is a static display after all.

 

Also, any other models I should be looking for feel free to suggest, but only if you think it SIGNIFICANTLY enhances the flight deck.

 

FC

[+EricJ 3,944]

http://combatace.com/uploads/monthly_01_2011/post-12105-037897900%201294229475.jpg

 

I'm liking this configuration but no birds in the Street or Six Pack... and two Fs like the image below.... Just with the two tank configuration since I'm sure you don't have the bombs which is fine...

 

Not sure if it's doable but one or two Es or Fs with full tanker four tanks and pod installed and tanks on the rest one on the centerline and one on the right inner (reflecting a combat configuration) and the few Gs just with two tanks.

 

CVN-75.

Edited January 7, 2011 by EricJ

[Vampyre 24]

So, to narrow down the parameters of the project:

 

The question is what aircraft for what time periods.

 

Here are the aircraft I have MAX files for so far (some were native, some I had to convert from other sources):

 

F-14A

FA-18A

FA-18E/F/G

EA-6B

A-6

E-2

F-35C

 

I am in the process of evaluating a few other models, including an A-7 and SH-60 from Sketchup to MAX.

 

I haven't found a decent Hoover or Sea King model yet, they may not be included.

 

My question to folks in the know is how many different variants of the flight deck should be made and which aircraft for which variant. Keep it simple, remember that nothing will be moving. Also, this will only encompass the Nimitz class carriers, and minor model differences (ie FA-18A vs FA-18C) won't be broken out...this is a static display after all.

 

Also, any other models I should be looking for feel free to suggest, but only if you think it SIGNIFICANTLY enhances the flight deck.

 

FC

 

The big question is what time periods are we looking at here?

A late 70's deck will have either F-14s or F-4's as the primary fighter with A-6's and A-7's as medium and light attack respectivly. You can also find the E-2/C-2's, H-3's, S-3's, EA-6B's, EKA-3's, and RA-5C's.

 

A mid 80's deck will have F-14's as the fighters. F/A-18A or A-7's will fulfill the light attack duties. The A-6 will still be medium attack. Then you are looking at having the E-2/C-2's, S-3's, EA-6B's, and maybe an EKA-3. It will be a toss up between the H-3 and H-60 platforms with the odds favoring the H-3.

 

A Mid 90's carrier will be F-14's, F/A-18C, S-3's, E-2/C-2's, H-60's, and EA-6B's.

 

In 2001 the Abe Lincoln had an air wing with F-14D's, F/A-18E's, F/A-18C's, S-3B's, EA-6B's, H-60's, and E-2/C-2's.

 

A current air wing has a F/A-18F, F/A-18E, two F/A-18C squadrons, plus the H-60's E-2/C-2's and either an EA-18G or EA-6B squadron.

 

CVW-5 on the GW will be the first all Super Hornet/Growler wing with no legacy hornets in the mix. It will still have the E-2/C-2, and H-60's.

 

in 2016 the F-35 will supposedly be in the mix too possibly taking the place of two of the Legacy Hornet squadrons from the current air wing set up.

 

Now if you wanted to go into other carriers such as Midway, Independance, Ranger, or Coral Sea, they had some interesting mixes of plane types as well... especially in the early 80's.

Edited January 7, 2011 by Vampyre

[FastCargo 412]

Simpler is better...the less overall configurations (ie different types of aircraft), the easier the work is.

 

FC

[FastCargo 412]

Okay, based on what models I've been able to find...

 

Nimitz class carrier:

 

Start - late 70s

F-14

A-6

A-7

E-2

EA-6B

 

80s (changes only)

FA-18A/C add

H-60 add

 

90s

A-6 delete

A-7 delete

 

00s (early)

FA-18E/F add

 

Current

F-14 delete

EA-6B delete

EA-18G add

 

Future

FA-18A/C delete

F-35C add

 

That's the plan right now...I haven't been able to find a good H-3 or S-3 model to add, and some of the other models will need some messaging before they are ready to use.

 

FC

[verde13 0]

Amazing work here, hopefully there will be a Vietnam era carrier setup as well

[+NGHENGO 14]

Okay, based on what models I've been able to find...

 

Nimitz class carrier:

 

Start - late 70s

F-14

A-6

A-7

E-2

EA-6B

 

80s (changes only)

FA-18A/C add

H-60 add

 

90s

A-6 delete

A-7 delete

 

00s (early)

FA-18E/F add

 

Current

F-14 delete

EA-6B delete

EA-18G add

 

Future

FA-18A/C delete

F-35C add

 

That's the plan right now...I haven't been able to find a good H-3 or S-3 model to add, and some of the other models will need some messaging before they are ready to use.

 

FC

 

Well now we really need some new Carriers......

 

Forrestal Class an Midway class.......We have almost the complete flight line for that.....

 

Mau.

 

 

 

[the test pilot 5]

Why not an overhauled Ark Royal. With the incoming buccaneer, could be interesting

[+SkateZilla 49]

For F-14s I think only VF-32 was on the CVN-75, I have a Completed E-2C Model on my latest beta build out to testers, Render Below, as I have not had time to download my email which will prolly have screenshots.

 

I can Merge Max 2009 Files into each other and place objects on the deck and animation them (Limited animations), As I did with My E-2C Model.

 

So if you'd like aircraft on the deck of my carrier model itself, all you'd need to do is send me a PM and get together some plans to implement them, and I will gladly credit the model/texture authors. Only bad side to Merging with the 3dS MAX File is it becomes part of the ground object, meaning No Lights.

 

I had plans after I get the shadowing optimized more to add aircraft and lighting using the "Plug" Method But delayed that Seeing as ALT+N will carry the plug to the next way point, and the weapons option was an option for me as my weapons systems are already implemented and Active.

 

If you Need any 3d Renders with X.y.Z Coordinate markers or anything let me know, anything that helps Strike Fighters I'll gladly do.

 

At this point my Latest Carrier build is optimized for the Strike Fighters 2 Series.

 

My studio Rig currently Runs 3DS Max 7, 2009 and 2011

Edited April 11, 2011 by SkateZilla

[+SkateZilla 49]

1. As far as I know, yes. The campaign engine has no way of knowing what cat to place the plane on.

 

2. In the above example, yes. BUT you can have as many cats as you need. So say you have a ship with 100 cats on it, you will place the plug on #100. You can also place as many plugs as you want. You could skip a cat by placing a plug with no objects linked to it...just an invisible place holder. I don't think placing your player on #1 and your wingie on #2 but skipping #3 with a plug and placing a live AI plane on #4 would work. I think #3 has to launch before #4 could launch....hmmm, will have to check that.

 

3. I tried to make it - FORCE it to show up but I couldn't get it to. I heard it give the correct response that it was rejoining but it was still on the cat. I waited about 30 min and nothing.

 

I would make the PLUGs part of a different Aircraft Group and assign the SQN and Aircraft in the Mission INI, So Make Flight 001 4 Planes to take up Cats 1-4, then Flights2, 3 , 4 takes up the "PLUG" Catapults (Assign AirCraft/Sqn as you Like), then Make More Flights that you would Like to Launch after that)

 

Also make one Max Model of the Carrier Deck Crew and Details (Tractors, Crew,etc and Export that model, textures and make an INI for it and slap it in the "AirCraft" folder)

 

So Make 16 plug catapults on the CVN, anmd Populate them in the mission file

 

Examples: (Im not gonna Post the Entire [AircraftMissionxxx] Section but the lines you should be looking at.

 

 

 

-- // Your Flight

[AircraftMission001]

AircraftType=F-14B_96 <<- YOUR FLIGHT'S PLANE

Name=SHOWTIME <<-- Your Flights Callsign

FormationType=USFighter <<-- Formation Type

Size=4 << -- Make this YOUR Flight Number so Your Flight Uses all 4 Regular Cats

MissionType=RECON <-- Your Mission Type

 

-- // Plug Flight 1 VF-32

[AircraftMission002]

AircraftType=F-14B_96_PLUG <<- PLUG FLIGHTS PLANE

Name=SHOWTIME <<-- PLUG Flight's Callsign

FormationType=USFighter <<-- Formation Type

Size=7 << -- How many Planes you want from this squadron

Squadron=VF32 << - PLUG Flight's Sqn

Loadout=Recon << - PLUG Flight's Loudout

 

-- // Plug Flight 2 VF-84

[AircraftMission003]

AircraftType=F-14B_96_PLUG <<- PLUG FLIGHTS PLANE

Name=SHOWTIME <<-- PLUG Fligh'ts Callsign

FormationType=USFighter <<-- Formation Type

Size=8 << -- How many Planes you want from this squadron

Squadron=VF84 << - PLUG Flights Sqn

Loadout=Recon << - PLUG Flight's Loudout

 

-- // Plug Carrier Deck Crew And Details

[AircraftMission003]

AircraftType=Cew_Details_PLUG <<- PLUG Model Name

Name=SHOWTIME <<-- PLUG Flight's Callsign (make sure its unique to the plugs)

FormationType=USFighter <<-- Formation Type

Size=1 << - Make sure its 1

Squadron= << - Make Sure its blank

Loadout= << - Make Sure its blank

 

 

**NOTICE THAT PLUG FLIGHT 1 and PLUG FLIGHT 2 ARE 15 Aircraft total, these 2 flights will populate the 15 Plug Catapults on the deck and teh "Details" Plug will take the last spot and Allow AircraftMission004 Onward to use the Functional 4 Catapults.**

 

-- // AI Flight 1

[AircraftMission005]

AircraftType= <<- AI FLIGHT'S PLANE

Name=SHOWTIME <<-- AI Flight's Callsign

FormationType=USFighter <<-- Formation Type

Size= 4

MissionType=RECON <-- AI Mission Type

Loadout=Recon << - AI Flight's Loudout

 

-- // AI Flight 2

[AircraftMission006]

AircraftType= <<- AI FLIGHT'S PLANE

Name=SHOWTIME <<-- AI Flight's Callsign

FormationType=USFighter <<-- Formation Type

Size= 4

MissionType=RECON <-- AI Mission Type

Loadout=Recon << - AI Flight's Loudout

Edited April 11, 2011 by SkateZilla