Starfighter 0 Posted July 9, 2007 Not mentioning any names, but someone got shot down today while trying to take on a pair of MiG-17s. Would any of y'all like to share tips for ACM and the like while being stuck in a Super Sabre? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Dave 2,322 Posted July 9, 2007 Not mentioning any names, but someone got shot down today while trying to take on a pair of MiG-17s. Would any of y'all like to share tips for ACM and the like while being stuck in a Super Sabre? Yeah, extend and escape. I wouldn't dog fight in an F-100 if you can avoid it. F-100D Maximum speed: 864 mph MIG-17F Maximum speed: 711 mph I would try a slashing attack against the Mig-17 because you are not going to out turn with the 17. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Brain32 265 Posted July 9, 2007 (edited) Well I usually make sure I have alt advantage on them, and then I BnZ the living sh1t out of them. Since they turn like a freakin' Spitfire, I tend to try to predict their brake off direction and approach a bit from left or right side so I can get a nice deflection shot Edited July 9, 2007 by Brain32 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Starfighter 0 Posted July 9, 2007 Yeah, the mission demanded that I (and a worthless wingman who died without a peep) take on some MiG-17s without so much as an AIM-9B available. BnZ'll probably be my only option when I try again. I really need to re-equip that squadron with F-104Cs. Thanks for the tips! It was fun running away from a MiG-17 in an earlier mission where the #2 ship crashed in the midst of trying to get me off his leader's tail. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skelator56 0 Posted July 9, 2007 Not mentioning any names, but someone got shot down today while trying to take on a pair of MiG-17s. Would any of y'all like to share tips for ACM and the like while being stuck in a Super Sabre? USAFMTL hit the nail on the head. Speed and altitude is life. If you have to turn, do it while the MiG is not committed on you during the initial phase of your fight. I have engaged MiG (Sim wise) with the F-100 and with the F-105 (I'm too young to have flown them over there). The key to success is speed and altitude. If you are bounced, drop your tanks, if you still have them, push over, and extend. If you are engaging head on (which is what I recommend) put some 20mm rounds in the air and pass head on as close as you can. A slight descending attack works great here (stay in burner the whole time). Blast through, seperate, extend, and reverse (use a half cuban eight to reverse). On the reversal, make sure that you are well clear on the bad guy before doing this. If you do this too close in to the fight, you might find yourself with a very unfriendly wingman. Keep your speed up! Make sure that the other guy in the pair (if it is a pair) is out of the fight and that your bogey is not setting you up for a drag and bag. If the bad guy gets nervous and tries to dash for home, you should be able to run him down (cut him off with a lead pursuit). If he starts turning to face you while you're going after him, make sure that you engage him head on. Do not let him get even a slight angle on you. Then we are back to square one. If he's getting close to an advantage on you, then set your last reversal 180 degrees out from a course for home. If you do not get him on the last pass then you are set up to head for home. Good luck, and watch out for 37mm grapefruit! Skelator Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buzzard 72 0 Posted December 29, 2007 I'd have to agree, if your in that dog F-100, DO NOT get into a circle fight with 17's. Keep your 'E', look for alt , use angles, blow thru and regroup...oh and watch your fuel! If they get on your tail and are at speed, nose down, full A/B and keep jinking (I suggest you just tell your wingman to stay on your wing unless he's outside the engagement, if that's the case have him run on the tailing Mig and hope for the best. Try and keep the Mig flying relatively straight that'll help you wingman). The S. Sabre is a sad A/A plane. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+starfighter2 117 Posted December 30, 2007 Off topic - That's interesting - another "Starfighter" but there is only one called "Starfighter2" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Longestpants 1 Posted December 30, 2007 USAFMTL hit the nail on the head. Speed and altitude is life. If you have to turn, do it while the MiG is not committed on you during the initial phase of your fight. I have engaged MiG (Sim wise) with the F-100 and with the F-105 (I'm too young to have flown them over there). The key to success is speed and altitude. If you are bounced, drop your tanks, if you still have them, push over, and extend. If you are engaging head on (which is what I recommend) put some 20mm rounds in the air and pass head on as close as you can. A slight descending attack works great here (stay in burner the whole time). Blast through, seperate, extend, and reverse (use a half cuban eight to reverse). On the reversal, make sure that you are well clear on the bad guy before doing this. If you do this too close in to the fight, you might find yourself with a very unfriendly wingman. Keep your speed up! Make sure that the other guy in the pair (if it is a pair) is out of the fight and that your bogey is not setting you up for a drag and bag. If the bad guy gets nervous and tries to dash for home, you should be able to run him down (cut him off with a lead pursuit). If he starts turning to face you while you're going after him, make sure that you engage him head on. Do not let him get even a slight angle on you. Then we are back to square one. If he's getting close to an advantage on you, then set your last reversal 180 degrees out from a course for home. If you do not get him on the last pass then you are set up to head for home. Good luck, and watch out for 37mm grapefruit! Skelator Although that is very good advice, I can do you one better: don't fly the F-100. Nothing Super about it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
triplethr3at 0 Posted December 30, 2007 Its super cool looking. especialy the f-100f Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+JSF_Aggie 1,292 Posted December 30, 2007 (edited) There is one thing can change. If you look in the _data.ini and check the 4 entries for the leading edge flaps, they have the lift coeficent values swapped for extended vs. retracted. They should create more lift when extended. If you fix this, it'll turn a little better, but don't loose your speed. The YAP F-100F has the same typo. Edited December 30, 2007 by JSF_Aggie Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buzzard 72 0 Posted December 30, 2007 thanks for that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sixgun 0 Posted January 17, 2008 There is one thing can change. If you look in the _data.ini and check the 4 entries for the leading edge flaps, they have the lift coeficent values swapped for extended vs. retracted. They should create more lift when extended. If you fix this, it'll turn a little better, but don't loose your speed. The YAP F-100F has the same typo. Aggie, can you clarify this? I don't know what I'm looking at when I see it. What needs to be changed? Is this it? [LeftOuterSlat] SystemType=HIGHLIFT_DEVICE CLiftdc=-0.0102 CDdc=0.0027 Cmdc=-0.0002 DeltaStallAlpha=2.34 AreaRatio=1.022 DeploymentMethod=AUTOMATIC_AERODYNAMIC_LOAD Setting[1].Angle=30.0 Setting[1].DeployValue=123.5 Setting[1].RetractValue=133.8 MaxDeflection=30.0 MinDeflection=0.0 ControlRate=2.0 AnimationID=3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sparkomatic 7 Posted January 17, 2008 I would not be so had on the AI wingman in that situation...people really did die without a peep... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Jarhead1 27 Posted January 17, 2008 What a way to go, not even know what hit u..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JediMaster 451 Posted January 18, 2008 Setting[1].DeployValue=123.5Setting[1].RetractValue=133.8 It's these two. Notice retract value is larger than deploy? That's backwards. Swap those 2 numbers. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ezlead 42 Posted January 19, 2008 Keep speed up,go verticle(45 to 90 nose up),then turn. If he turns inside go nose down and extend. Extend out a couple of miles go verticle,turn into him. Take him ALMOST head on. Throw out some 20mm and watch him run into it. I fly the Hun a lot and get shot down about 20 percent of the time. Usually when I get greedy for another kill. Knock down a couple of Migs and head for home. (Warp 9 ) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Bounder Posted January 19, 2008 the only way u can turn fight with them is what I saw a guy do,and he showed me lower flaps full,and wheel's. But a slash is the preferred ACM issued by AF command at the time. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sixgun 0 Posted January 22, 2008 It's these two. Notice retract value is larger than deploy? That's backwards. Swap those 2 numbers. I'm not so sure that this is right, guys. What does this value represent? If it is a drag or angle of attack coefficient then it seems right like it is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest zerocinco Posted January 23, 2008 Setting[1].DeployValue=123.5 Setting[1].RetractValue=133.8 The deploy value and the retract value are in the correct order. Slow down, the slats come out. Speed up, they retract. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Dave 2,322 Posted January 23, 2008 Although that is very good advice, I can do you one better: don't fly the F-100. Nothing Super about it. Says you. :stink: :fuk: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Julhelm 266 Posted January 23, 2008 Easiest way to beat them is letting them get on your 6 and just flatplating the bird. Works every time. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Tailspin 3 Posted January 23, 2008 Re: slat deployment...Why is there a 20kt. difference in the Deploy/Retract speed to begin with? You don't need to swap the values, just make the Deploy speed the same as the Retract speed (Actually I have the Deploy speed .5 less than Retract)....that is unless the Hun was actually set up to have the difference IRL? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+JSF_Aggie 1,292 Posted January 23, 2008 (edited) Aggie, can you clarify this? I don't know what I'm looking at when I see it. What needs to be changed? Is this it? [LeftOuterSlat] SystemType=HIGHLIFT_DEVICE CLiftdc=-0.0102 CDdc=0.0027 Cmdc=-0.0002 DeltaStallAlpha=2.34 AreaRatio=1.022 DeploymentMethod=AUTOMATIC_AERODYNAMIC_LOAD Setting[1].Angle=30.0 Setting[1].DeployValue=123.5 Setting[1].RetractValue=133.8 MaxDeflection=30.0 MinDeflection=0.0 ControlRate=2.0 AnimationID=3 Along time ago, some one posted on Thirdwire that "DeployValue" and "RetractValue" were the lift coeficients, and hence backwards in the _Data.ini. I just took it as correct until the other day when USAFMTL and I were making some skins, and I looked actually looked at it. As others have said, they're velocity values for deployment, and shouldn't be swapped. Edited January 23, 2008 by JSF_Aggie Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JediMaster 451 Posted January 23, 2008 Oh, those aren't lift values? In that case they're pretty odd. Why 133.8 and not 134? Why 123.5 and not 124? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
+Tailspin 3 Posted January 24, 2008 They are conversions of 260 and 240 knots to m/s (rounded off). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
