DCS World remains my primary sim despite some disappointment

[+streakeagle 871]

DCS progress on integrating the old with the new into what will be Version 2.5 has been incredibly slow. I don't do "betas", which means I haven't even experienced the new Nevada map. My refusal to install the 2.x beta is somewhat ironic because even the current official release version 1.5.4. xxx is really a beta with all the bugs that get released despite beta testing. The aircraft that brought me to DCS World, the MiG-21bis actually seems to get worse over time. Leatherneck doesn't take kindly to criticism, yet can't ever live up to even one announcement on fixes and/or dates. Don't even talk to me about VEAO, their Hawk, or the P-40F.

 

But that is all I have to say that is negative. Despite old and new bugs, the Leatherneck MiG-21bis is still one of the most amazing aircraft I have ever flown in any sim. The F-86F and MiG-15bis almost bring tears to my eyes with the level of immersion they bring to flying those aircraft. The DCS P-51D, Bf109K4, and Fw190D9 are the only WW2 aircraft I will fly for any length of time after years of Aces High being my favorite WW2 air combat sim. And when it comes to helos, NOTHING else even comes close to touching the DCS UH-1H and Mi-8. Even the Flaming Cliffs F-15C and Su-27 appear to be modeled better than in any other sim with those aircraft. While I prefer air-to-air combat, the level of immersion in DCS World is such that I am perfectly happy enjoying cold starts, talking to the ground crew and control tower on the radio, taxiing, taking off, following real-world approach procedures, and landing. 

 

If DCS World had a global map, like FSX, especially with the option to populate that map with objects based on the current date, it would be THE mother of all flight sims.

 

I am eagerly awaiting the F-5E, F/A-18C, Viggen, and P-40F. The F-5E in Nevada will be especially cool. I would like to be an F-5E/MiG-21bis pilot that takes down online players flying F-15Cs, but I can settle with taking down much easier to kill AI F-15Cs since I will probably never have the skill/luck to kill human players in F-15Cs.

 

DCS World's glaring limitation is that the world is restricted to the Black Sea and or Nevada. With the completion of the WW2 Normandy map and decent Korea, Vietnam, and Israel/Middle East maps with period correct objects, DCS World could be the absolute best combat flight sim ever produced. One can only hope that they reach their goals before going bankrupt.

[+daddyairplanes 10,243]

just as counterpoint, all the faults and wishes listed are why i like SF2,  even with ALL ITS' faults. when DCS finally has many places to fly or at least 1/3 the available aircraft (stock or mod) i will get interested and drop the money. for now it's on the list for my family to get for a bday or Christmas but they always aim for cheaper stuff (trying to keep me happy with misapplied budget control). It is quite awesome, but i cant paint up DC-8s for it (airliner skins having become a recent hobby of mine). yeah, basically boils down to variety

 

one glaring fault i noticed not mentioned above is the lack of a certain McAir product that is abundant in SF2

[+Stary 2,427]

the biggest prblem for me is the terrains. Nevada is ok for Red Flag I suppose but who sane would play RF scenarios? Ahh right, Streak and Dave. The lack of 3rd part custom maps like indeed Israel or nam or even some generic SEA is joykiller. The same for lack of any custom campaigns generator system, but that I have to recheck. Anyway, my modules lay uninstalled and have not played it in months. 2015 was the time I think lol. So no, not really DCS guy

[+SkateZilla 49]

Problem is Nobody that does terrains for other sims is even attempting to engage in dialog w/ ED to get an agreement for the tools.

The Tools are not freely distributed, and w/ Good Reason,

Especially now since People are Ripping Models from Other games in attempts to bring to DCS.

[+mue 715]

The Tools are not freely distributed, and w/ Good Reason,

 

I'm curious, what is a "Good Reason" for not freely distribute those tools?

[+Stary 2,427]

On phone. Seems my reply got eaten.

 

Maybe ED wants to have hand on everything and dislikes free modding as free mods = no ED's profits

[+mue 715]

On phone. Seems my reply got eaten.

 

Maybe ED wants to have hand on everything and dislikes free modding as free mods = no ED's profits

 

Ok, but thats not a good reason, at least for us modders.

[jeanba 1,920]

the biggest prblem for me is the terrains. Nevada is ok for Red Flag I suppose but who sane would play RF scenarios? Ahh right, Streak and Dave. The lack of 3rd part custom maps like indeed Israel or nam or even some generic SEA is joykiller.

That's exactly my problem with DCS

I played lockon for quite a few time but I am tired of crimea

I would like to test the 2000 but not over crimea nor nevada

[+SkateZilla 49]

I stated a good reason,

Too many unlicensed users are ripping or using ripped models from other sims and attempting to bring them to DCS already. (At least for the Aircraft Mods).

We dont need them trying to rip FSX landscape meshes etc to attempt importing to DCS.

The Terrain Building is a different story altogether, they would like to make sure anyone given the SDK for terrain (and likely access to other things), has the ability to produce the terrain in full.

Has nothing to do with licensing, and more to do w/ quality control and asset protection.

 

 

There are Videos on YT of the Landscape SDK, it's a pretty spiffy and developed GUI.

 

Edited July 19, 2016 by SkateZilla

[MigBuster 2,884]

The MiG-15bis is one of my favourites.............probably the simplicity of it and the challenge to actually hit anything with its guns!.and the radio is pretty cool........am waiting for the campaign which should be about soon.

 

Once you have the terrains then you need the environment for each period (which SF2 has)  including the vehicles and weapons. The date system TK employs is simple but pretty amazing.............. just calling in the objects for those years, allowing skins and other things like base moves to change on certain dates.

[+Stary 2,427]

more so the more DCS starts to feel like uber realistic "Dogfights" the less I take is as a fun engaging game*

 

cough FW-190D vs F-86 vs A-10C cough

 

 

 

 

 

*thy who dares disagreeing -dude it is a game

[+HungaroJET 2]

Too many unlicensed users are ripping or using ripped models from other sims and attempting to bring them to DCS already. (At least for the Aircraft Mods).

 

Be happy till people does not start to bring DCS models into FSX, P3D or SFS.  

Edited July 19, 2016 by HungaroJET

[Viggen 644]

I've been messing around in DCS 1.5 for about a week now. I've got the Hawk, Mirage 2000C, and Mi-8. But simming on a budget and a laptop means I'm not able to fully enjoy and experience DCS or the new modules with the clickable cockpits since I've got a reduced keyboard compared to a desktop. Because of this, I'm pretty much limited to aircraft without the clickable cockpits, which is a shame, because I enjoy learning the starting procedures and switchology. So, until I either win the lottery or ED gives it a clickable cockpit, I'll be learning the F-15C and MiG-29G or going back to SF2.

[+streakeagle 871]

However slow and problematic it may be... the best part about DCS World is that it is steadily progressing. The game engine, the core modules, and the third party addons are all steadily getting better. Whereas SF2 is a dead engine. The terrain engine for SFP1 was obsolete from the day it was released and SF2NA's new terrain engine was a failure for me (and apparently the modding community since absolutely no one has been able to release a terrain based on its "improved" tech). The DCS World plane set has significant overlap with the SFP1/SF2 plane set at this point. There is not one aircraft that I can fly in both sims for which I prefer flying SF2 over DCS World. The F-4, the century series, MiG-23, and F2H-2 are the principal aircraft that draw me back to SF2 at all. I hope DCS World eventually covers most of those aircraft before ED goes out of business or I get too old to enjoy them.

[+Julhelm 266]

I stated a good reason,

 

Too many unlicensed users are ripping or using ripped models from other sims and attempting to bring them to DCS already. (At least for the Aircraft Mods).

 

We dont need them trying to rip FSX landscape meshes etc to attempt importing to DCS.

 

The Terrain Building is a different story altogether, they would like to make sure anyone given the SDK for terrain (and likely access to other things), has the ability to produce the terrain in full.

 

Has nothing to do with licensing, and more to do w/ quality control and asset protection.

 

 

There are Videos on YT of the Landscape SDK, it's a pretty spiffy and developed GUI.

 

So the terrains are essentially handmade? No wonder it took them forever to do the Nevada terrain. That toolset looks awful to work with.

[Boresight 51]

My impressions on DCS:

 

positive

- very good graphics for AC and scenarios;

- very good flight models for the majority of their AC;

- very good fidelity in AC avionics;

- MiG-21bis (for instance) really is something.

 

negative

- decreasing game performance with the continuous updates, neither 1.5.3 or 2.0 are as stable or fluid as 1.5.2 version;

(many complaints on how the graphics / performance go down, if player doesn't upgrade RAM; CPU; GPU; etc.)

- some flight model updates for AC like the MiG-29 are taking forever - I believe it's the same as in LOMAC times ?

- few scenarios (only Black Sea or Nevada);

 

However... I appreciate it a lot, just like SF2, and I can't wait to see the Leatherneck's F-14 Tomcat.

Edited July 20, 2016 by Boresight

[+SkateZilla 49]

So the terrains are essentially handmade? No wonder it took them forever to do the Nevada terrain. That toolset looks awful to work with.

 

 

No, Roads, Coastlines, etc etc are placed after terrain data is imported. That video is over a year old, I doubt the SDK even looks like that anymore.

[JediMaster 451]

I've been messing around in DCS 1.5 for about a week now. I've got the Hawk, Mirage 2000C, and Mi-8. But simming on a budget and a laptop means I'm not able to fully enjoy and experience DCS or the new modules with the clickable cockpits since I've got a reduced keyboard compared to a desktop. Because of this, I'm pretty much limited to aircraft without the clickable cockpits, which is a shame, because I enjoy learning the starting procedures and switchology. So, until I either win the lottery or ED gives it a clickable cockpit, I'll be learning the F-15C and MiG-29G or going back to SF2.

 

External mouse and keyboard?

[ironroad 218]

The major issue for me was that the LOMAC and DCS world, mind you I have only been playing since LockOn1.0, has been to sterile and the AI has always been a sore spot when it comes to the mission editor. No immersive coms or scripts like Jane's and the lacking mission and campaign editor tools tools of Falcon 4.0.

 

Despite the negatives, the positives have always been cutting edge graphics that get improved with every successive generation, a mission editor functions that were finally addressed with DCS world, and at least some semblance of developer support going forward.

 

Yes at times I feel we (as the customer) have been jerked around given the old "over promise and under deliver" routine but in the grand scheme of things at least we are getting SOMETHING in the combat flight sim world while most developers are looking for the next Call of Duty-Candy Crush clone for xbox for iphone.

[+streakeagle 871]

It does suffer from the "sterile" effect that IL-2 also had. But DCS World has some events that aren't so sterile. It can be scripted to look and feel a lot like MS FSX in terms of traffic and comms. Lots of work on the mission author's end, but even basic missions are fairly entertaining to me with just a few events taking place outside of my focus... stray traffic, radio comms, etc. But the flight and systems modeling combined with the graphics is so much more immersive for me than SF2... and the combat, however limited the AI are, is by far better than anything you can do in FSX, even with the latest 3rd party addons. So DCS gives you a sim whose graphics, scripting, and systems modeling is comparable, if not superior to FSX and combat functionality that is generally as good as SF2. 

 

The area that FSX and SF2 smack down DCS World is the maps... or lack of them and the the objects that need to exist on those maps for significant time frames. I am still waiting for the 2.x engine to prove that it is going to close that gap significantly while I am still young enough to enjoy it. The Normandy 1944 map needs to be done well enough to impress and win over WW2 fans from other WW2 air combat sims. The F/A-18C needs a great carrier and the Middle East map to show off the new engine in the modern era. But ED is missing a huge opportunity if it doesn't provide an awesome Korean War package. The most recent competition is MiG Alley and the SFP1/SF2 KAW mods. Model Korea and the combatants on the ground, in the air, and at sea decently, and you will have an amazing one-of-a-kind sim/game. 

[+streakeagle 871]

I just tried out the new F-5E. It is a little rough as an early beta... but extremely impressive.

I can't wait to see how the F-14A, AJS-37, and F/A-18C turn out.

I can remember when I used to host SFP1 multiplayer 24/7 and there was a mod that added the F-5 and F-14. I loved the F-5 a lot.

[ironroad 218]

I pre-purchased the uhh "MIG 28" :-), but wasn't going to download right away for fear of getting something under a quarter done. Don't mind paying for planned modules that will have consistent follow-up, but not looking to pay to be an pre-alpha tester at the moment.

[+ST0RM 145]

Whats rough about it? Its one of the more complete modules released lately. It flies and handles pretty well. I've had some great time in it already. 

 

-S

[+streakeagle 871]

Like previous Belsimtek releases, their the F-5 beta is better than many other sims' final releases. But look in the last round of patches and look at the bug list on the ED forums. It is still listed as a beta because it still has the rough spots to be expected of a beta. 

[+streakeagle 871]

I have been out of country for two weeks and just now got the chance to try the latest patch. LCOS gunsight works much better now. It didn't move before.