Massive Penetrator in development

[+Typhoid 231]

Here are some new interesting modelling opportunities! Should make some interesting effects pack mods!

 

"NGC Begins Work to Equip B-2 Bomber with Massive Penetrator Weapon

 

(Palmdale, Calif., July 19, 2007) -- The U.S. Air Force's B-2 stealth bomber would be able to attack and destroy an expanded set of hardened, deeply buried military targets using a new 30,000 pound-class penetrator weapon that Northrop Grumman (NYSE:NOC) has begun integrating on the aircraft.

 

The company is doing the work under a seven-month, $2.5 million contract awarded June 1 by the Air Force's Aeronautical Systems Center, Wright Patterson AFB, Ohio.

 

Northrop Grumman is the Air Force's prime contractor on the B-2, the flagship of the nation's long-range strike arsenal.

 

The new Massive Ordnance Penetrator (MOP), which is being developed by The Boeing Company, is a GPS-guided weapon containing more than 5,300 pounds of conventional explosives inside a 20.5-foot long enclosure of hardened steel. It is designed to penetrate dirt, rock and reinforced concrete to reach enemy bunker or tunnel installations. The B-2 is capable of carrying two MOPs, one in each weapons bay.

 

"This integration contract is part of Northrop Grumman's on-going effort to ensure that the B-2 remains capable of delivering a decisive blow to an increasingly sophisticated enemy," said Dave Mazur, vice president of long-range strike for the company's Integrated Systems sector. "It is the first step in helping the Air Force make this new weapon available for operational use on the B-2."

 

According to Mazur, the Air Force is expected to make a decision later this year on whether to develop a limited operational capability for the MOP, or to proceed with a more comprehensive development program that would optimize the weapon's operational utility.

 

The current contract will focus on adapting the B-2's weapon bay fixtures to accommodate the new weapon. The B-2 is currently equipped to carry up to 40,000 pounds of conventional ordnance. It can be configured, for example, to carry up to 80 500-lb class GPS-guided bombs or 36 750-lb class bombs in its smart bomb rack assembly, or up to 16 2,000-lb class weapons in its rotary launch assembly.

 

 

 

Source : Northrop Grumman Corporation

For more information on Northrop Grumman Corporation

visit their Company Profile on ASDSource."

[eraser_tr 29]

Jeez, the 20k pound MOAB they were testing wasn't enough?

[+Typhoid 231]

Jeez, the 20k pound MOAB they were testing wasn't enough?

 

against the increasingly protected, deep bunker type construction - no. What they really need is the nuclear penetrator - but our weak-kneed Congress killed that program.

[+Fates 63]

If they can't find him in the mountains......remove the mountains.

[TX3RN0BILL 3]

against the increasingly protected, deep bunker type construction - no. What they really need is the nuclear penetrator - but our weak-kneed Congress killed that program.

 

 

Agreed, a nuclear penetrator would make alot more sense than a normal one... I hope it'll end up an FAB at least...

 

One thing that does strike me as odd though is the option to use the B-2 as launch platform, since the B-52 makes alot more sense, since the B-2's attack profile, if I'm not mistaken, is to fly low, which would deny the new MOP any benefits of kinetic energy ocurring during normal, conventional, high-altitude-release bombing, since the impact velocity (and therefore strength) of the MOP dropped from a high altitude is much superior to when it's dropped from a rather low altitude. Plus the B-52's body looks more apt to carry such a MOP than the B-2's sleek fuselage... or maybe even the B-1... just my two cents on the issue...

[FastCargo 412]

Actually, most of our operations have switched to medium/high altitude.

 

The thing we learned from the last decade is that although countries can buy lots of SAMs, they usually can't afford the more lethal stuff...and/or the SAMs get killed off early in the air war.

 

But AAA and MANPADs are cheap and easy to hide, so you can have buttloads of them around and can't kill them easily. So your better option is doing everything high altitude.

 

Also, assuming you are using kinetic energy, you actually want a high altitude drop. Low altitude drops are usually for high drag weapons, otherwise, you'd blow yourself up with the frag pattern of the bombs you drop. This assumes the weapon (MOP) doesn't have some sort of small rocket engine to help the penetration once it's centered over the target.

 

Finally, the MOAB is an area weapon, not a penetrator. The MOAB is for large structures, anti personnel, maybe even mine detonation. You could kill a bunker, but only if the bunker was fairly shallow or thin skinned.

 

FastCargo

[Redddevil911 0]

That thing sound like a monster

[Guest Saganuay82]

Weak kneed? You actually think that a nuclear penetrator is a good thing? These are the days that are getting away from nukes. Lets go and make another nuke weapon. All the nuke penetrators would not have made any difference in what was the outcome of Iraq or Afghanistan.

[+Zurawski 33]

Must... resist... making... sex toy inuendo....

[MigBuster 2,884]

Must... resist... making... sex toy inuendo....

 

ha ha - the title is too suggestive!

[+Typhoid 231]

Weak kneed? You actually think that a nuclear penetrator is a good thing? These are the days that are getting away from nukes. Lets go and make another nuke weapon. All the nuke penetrators would not have made any difference in what was the outcome of Iraq or Afghanistan.

 

in limited circumstances a capability to reach and destroy a deeply buried, hardened structure is a shortfall that we have. In the Iraq war, yes, we could not destroy any of the hardened bunkers. We could only destroy the surface facilities. In several other countries, deeply buried and hardened facilities are used to protect critcal assets including nuclear armed ballistic missiles, command bunkers, nuclear research and production facilities, etc.

 

finding them is hard enough. Killing them in many cases is impossible.

 

if you accept that we have a military for the purpose of waging war when necessary against potential enemies that sometimes use deeply buried facilities to protect critical assetts, you need to address the issue of placing those assetts "at risk". At the present time, there are only two approaches, neither of which is available at present, to destroy such targets without stepping up to strategic nuclear weapons with massive and widespread destruction.

 

those two means are using conventional ICBMs dropping "rods from God" concrete enclosed steel rods to impart focused kinetic energy sufficient to reach down and get them or,

a penetrator with a sub-kiloton or one kiloton warhead to impart sufficient shock energy into the ground structure to destroy the target.

 

the 30,000lb penetrator is the obvious attempt to find another means to do that without going to those rather extreme steps. My issue with the week-kneed Congress is that when we are down to about 10% of the nuclear capabilities we once had, the idea of building a handfull of modern, sub-kiloton weapons is somehow beyond consideration.

Edited July 21, 2007 by Typhoid

[+Dave 2,322]

GBU-51 Pave Giant.....made one for the sim already.....works good.

[FastCargo 412]

those two means are using conventional ICBMs dropping "rods from God" concrete enclosed steel rods to impart focused kinetic energy sufficient to reach down and get them

 

This is not a new idea. Back somewhere in the 50s, THOR was just such a project.

 

Rods From God link

 

The funny thing is, there really isn't anything preventing building and deploying such devices because they aren't nuclear weapons. Just steel or tungsten rods. You put a bunch of small sats up with every Shuttle launch, deploying a rapid response web. You need a quick response, you deorbit a few sats, the 'flying crowbars' deploy and come in just shy of Mach 25. They wouldn't have to be big, unless you needed a bunker killer. They couldn't do it then because accuracy was so bad (that's why nukes were so large), but now, you can put very small, accurate guidance systems on RVs (reentry vehicles) and get a LOT closer.

 

Like the A-10 gun...except on a whole other level of kinetic energy.

 

FastCargo

[eraser_tr 29]

Weak kneed my ass. Sane is more like it, no congress in their right mind would support using nuclear weapons in anything but a World War 3 MAD scenario.

 

Think about it. Nuclear weapons, in the 62 years since they've been around they were used only twice to put an end to world war 2. And those were primitive and weak in comparison to what we made afterwards. Is a bunker really worth thousands of years of radiation( and the risk the nuclear material could fall into the wrong hands)?

[FOTF 0]

Oh wow....what a let down. I had a completely different idea about what this thread was a about.

 

 

Seriously though....kenetic energy is amazing....I saw a champ car race where there was an accident at the beginning of the pit lane. One of the cars involved broke a tire off and it rolled harmlessly down the pit lane. It was going 5 mph...maybe. A pit crew stuck his foot out to stop it, and the kenectic energy alone was enough to break his leg in 3 spots

[Wrench 9,851]

I'm with Paul and Zur ... I thought it had something to do with dirty movies!!! (actualy, I think I've seen that one already....)

 

Interesting side note on Project Thor; those that've read the Niven/Pournell novel "Footfall" will remember the strikes from orbit against the US tanks/APC in Kansas by the Snouts

 

Wrench

kevin stein

[FastCargo 412]

Ah Footfall...awesome book!! And by the end...we build an Orion!

 

"God was knocking, and he wanted in bad!"

 

FastCargo

[SayethWhaaaa 245]

Oh what?? I thought this had something to do with the latest Ron Jeremy film...

[eraser_tr 29]

Oh what?? I thought this had something to do with the latest Ron Jeremy film...

 

hairy, fat and ugly....

 

At first I thought someone had leaked the film of me and Genesis Rodriguez, but then I thought "ooh bombs, even better"

[+Typhoid 231]

Weak kneed my ass. Sane is more like it, no congress in their right mind would support using nuclear weapons in anything but a World War 3 MAD scenario.

 

Think about it. Nuclear weapons, in the 62 years since they've been around they were used only twice to put an end to world war 2. And those were primitive and weak in comparison to what we made afterwards. Is a bunker really worth thousands of years of radiation( and the risk the nuclear material could fall into the wrong hands)?

 

you've never heard of tactical nuclear weapons?

[eraser_tr 29]

Yes. It's still a nuclear weapon and leaves the area radioactive regardless of the yield. The overall levels are lower. But using them at all is a slippery slope, if you use the weakest, its not too much to use slightly larger ones, and slightly larger ones after that and so on.

 

Besides, I read about those "rods from god" fastcargo linked to, those could reach the same level of penetration. She wouldn't walk right for weeks :tomato2:

[+whiteknight06604 934]

Yes. It's still a nuclear weapon and leaves the area radioactive regardless of the yield. The overall levels are lower. But using them at all is a slippery slope, if you use the weakest, its not too much to use slightly larger ones, and slightly larger ones after that and so on.

 

Besides, I read about those "rods from god" fastcargo linked to, those could reach the same level of penetration. She wouldn't walk right for weeks :tomato2:

 

I wouldn't be too worried about radiation.if the weapon is designed to penetrate deep into the earth then explode it not much different than the hundreds of underground tests that have been done.I'd rather not see nukes used but to be honest I don't see any thing different between a giant conventional weapon and a small nuke.dead is dead if i get killed in an underground bunker i'm not gonna be any happier about the situation if it was a conventional weapon.Nukes are no more "evil" than any other weapon.It's more how you use it than what it is.One guy killed 30+ people at VT with a pistol and we killed 100000+ with some nukes to end WW2 one was a moral use one was murder.Nukes have this stigma attached to them from years of coldwar scares.I shudder to think of nukes being used on any large scale but if nukes were used to take out a rouge nuke facility saving untold lives it's not an evil but a plus.

[Longestpants 1]

Old news. I have had a massive, massive penetrator for some time.

[+whiteknight06604 934]

Old news. I have had a massive, massive penetrator for some time.

 

 

way to much information.

[eraser_tr 29]

Old news. I have had a massive, massive penetrator for some time.

 

My hovercraft is full of eels.