Wings Over Israel [Official Thread]

[MigBuster 2,884]

In the meanwhile I was trying to engage BVR. The new AI is so good at beaming that obtaining and mantaing a lock for a AIM-7 to reach its target is impossible. May I am doing somethign wrong, but I feel this is unrealistic.

 

 

hmm well who knows - but you can break a lock in Falcon fairly easily at range - and so can the bad guys - and thats supposed to be 1990s tech pulse doppler radars.

 

I suppose you could use a Plane that doesnt use the doppler shift thingy - so you shouldnt be able to beam an F-4 with an older radar (AFAIK).

[Canadair 16]

True but LGBs are programmed differently from Mavericks because they require designation, and when no laser designator is carried, the game assumes that only the primary target is designated. Since AI never attack the primary target by design...you can see the problem...no targets that they can attack are designated. Theoretically your wingman should be able to attack the primary with an LGB since you can select the target and issue the "Attack my target" command.

 

I don't want to seem offensive or anything , I am just frustrated with this topic. I have the feeling that all the knowledge, all the familiarity with the game details and intricacies disappear when I touch thi thread. Is it a tabooo?

 

The problem is true for EOGR, LGB, EOGB and for AI-flights, not Player's flight. Your wingman, "practically" not "throretically" attacks with LGBs EOGR, EOGB the targets you command him to to attack. So does the second element, even if according to another debatable idea ot TK, they won't attack primary, so in TK's words "the player can focus on the primary target bomb run!" (which goes along the same line of TK's words "we limited AIM-7 efficinecy giving AI super-beaming, so the player is drawn into dogfight!" debatable and not realistic)

 

Now, I buy, play and advertise and support TW's products, I actually love them, I just would like them better, and more realistic, and I don't see why we have to hide head under the sand and not underline obvious game's problems and limitations. Also I can't' see, how the few ideas that I have would create a big problem in playabilty, and take the game great realism and playaBILITY'S balance away.

MAybe there ar some programming problems or difficulties, which is understanding and fine, being TK a one man show. But is more honest to admit it; "I can't have AI flights realise AG guided ordance, because I don't have time/skill/resources/manpower, to program that" It is more honest. I /WE will lvoe TK anyway and buy his product.

The feeling I have is some sort of TK's fear to make the game too realistic and lose teh confrontation with console' games.

Edited March 18, 2008 by Canadair

[column5 63]

The problem is true for EOGR, LGB, EOGB and for AI-flights, not Player's flight. Your wingman, "practically" not "throretically" attacks with LGBs EOGR, EOGB the targets you command him to to attack. So does the second element, even if according to another debatable idea ot TK, they won't attack primary, so in TK's words "the player can focus on the primary target bomb run!" (which goes along the same line of TK's words "we limited AIM-7 efficinecy giving AI super-beaming, so the player is drawn into dogfight!" debatable and not realistic)

 

Well here is a novel idea...make the default loadouts use dumb bombs so the other flights won't have a problem. Who gives a damn what kind of bomb some other flight is dropping anyway?

[+Dave 2,322]

 

And by the way, the F-22 works well in a campaign.

[Canadair 16]

 

And by the way, the F-22 works well in a campaign.

Would work even better deploying JDAM and SDB rain

[+Dave 2,322]

Would work even better deploying JDAM and SDB rain

 

They do. I assign them targets or tell them to attack ground targets and it works.

[Canadair 16]

They do. I assign them targets or tell them to attack ground targets and it works.

 

Dave, as you already know, it works for your flight and not for the flight whose ground attack you are covering.

Right?

[+Dave 2,322]

Dave, as you already know, it works for your flight and not for the flight whose ground attack you are covering.

Right?

 

Some times it does, sometimes it don't. Flew an intercept mission today and the TU-16's hit my airbase with A2G missiles. You can't predict what its going to do but ITS NOT A SHOW STOPPER. I have to agree with C5 though, I don't care what the other flights do. I fly my mission not theirs.

[Canadair 16]

Some times it does, sometimes it don't. Flew an intercept mission today and the TU-16's hit my airbase with A2G missiles. You can't predict what its going to do but ITS NOT A SHOW STOPPER. I have to agree with C5 though, I don't care what the other flights do. I fly my mission not theirs.

I must be the only one intersted in this I guess. I just received an answer for TK, who said that this is amtter of time and programming decisions. It is okei. I rest my case.

In 2008, the only flight sim in which modern generation fighters will use guided weapons less or more properly is Falcon4, a project, althoguh incredably updated, that goes back to 1998, and Lock-on with its limitations.

A shame SFP1 can't. It is so sad to see entire flights with JSOWs under the wings, overflying their targets, negating the idea itself of JSOWS,and stand-off, for example, and going back to base. My own escort mission is purposeless iif bombers do not deploy their weapons.

I rest my case. This is the last post on this topic. Thanks for the patience to all of you

Edited March 18, 2008 by Canadair

[+EricJ 4,245]

 

And by the way, the F-22 works well in a campaign.

 

I agree bro, column5 really did answer the question. Only in the future we can hope that TK will make the AI "smarter"

[+EricJ 4,245]

Actually the GBU-39/40 SDBs work fine for AI, I was doing a CAS mssion earlier and it worked great (see piccie)

[+Brainless 1]

Wrench’s IsraelME_upgrade

 

Well it’s another ‘first’ isn’t it. I spent all yesterday afternoon loading up the terrain and objects as per Wrench’s README for this superb enhancement for WOI. Yes I finally got round to getting the new version. Good isn’t it.

 

Yes I did read the whole of his README, read it through three times, printed it out, studied it, absorbed the contents thoroughly and than proceeded to do it all wrong. Well you can’t help some people can you!

 

I got confused about the ‘tiles’ needed but finallay got it right with the GermanyCE terrain. He does say this in the readme but I got cockey and that served me right.

 

Anyway I got it all to go now and it’s working just fine except …well there’s always an ’except’ isn’t there…the following.

 

These having nothing to do with the upgrade directly but with some of the objects by various people. Firstly I’ve got to say they are really fine looking pieces and somehow look better in WOI than the similar ones in WOE. No doubt you guys will give me the technical reasons for this but as far as I’m concerned it’s just great eyecandy and I do like my sweets!

 

Right here we go:-

 

M48A1 Chapparal has no rockets/ordnance I think this came from Pasko’s desert pack. Great stuff but it would look and work even better if I had the rockets to go with it.

 

SA-3 single, SA-3 double, SA-3 Quad, HawkL-Hawk launcher and SA- have the same problem with no rockets/ordnance. I’m not sure where these came from now but I expect you guys know.

 

In my ‘test objects’ mission (I always do one of these for any new sim/mods/objects) the HawkL-standalone doesn’t show up. Now this object didn’t show in WOE and I never got to the bottom of why that didn’t work in that version either so I’m stumped.

 

M48A3 doesn’t show either I can hear the sound of it moving but it is invisible. Funnily enough it works fine in Woe but not in WOI.- strange that.

 

I expect someone will come up with the reasons for all of this and I’ve probably ‘done a Brainless’ somewhere but any information would be useful.

 

Other than these minor issues it all works fine and I can confirm everything works just dandy and looks just great so I’m pleased my bucks were well spent. I don’t seem to have any problem shooting down the enemy. I thought the AIs were more aggressive in WOI but I can’t say I’ve found this yet and I’m grateful ‘cos at least I’m still breathing

[kukulino 1]

Right here we go:-

 

M48A1 Chapparal has no rockets/ordnance I think this came from Pasko’s desert pack. Great stuff but it would look and work even better if I had the rockets to go with it.

 

SA-3 single, SA-3 double, SA-3 Quad, HawkL-Hawk launcher and SA- have the same problem with no rockets/ordnance. I’m not sure where these came from now but I expect you guys know.

 

I try explane something:

 

This is from Wrench’s IsraelME_upgrade ReadMe:

 

"THIS IS FOR WoI -ONLY!!! IT CANNOT BE USED ON ANY OTHER TERRAIN, EXCEPTING THE STOCK ISREALME IN WoI!!!!"

 

And another note in Wrench’s IsraelME_upgrade ReadMe:

"It is designed to use either the Bunyap or Mirage Factory Weapons Pak"

 

According to these notes, you can use Jul2006 weps pack or MF weps pack - merged with MF weps pack for WOI (if you are using just MF weps pack for WOI, there are not included SA-3, Chapparal missiles, etc). That's it I suppose.

 

How merge two different weapons packs see this link (post nm 4 by Sony Tuckson):

http://forum.combatace.com/index.php?showtopic=23529

Edited March 24, 2008 by kukulino

[+Gocad 26]

Actually the GBU-39/40 SDBs work fine for AI, I was doing a CAS mssion earlier and it worked great (see piccie)

 

The AI pilots under your control are capable of using them, other AI flights however do not use them. That's the issue Canadair was complaining about.

[blaze_1283 0]

i've been looking for this game for a while!!!! where can i find it?

[+Spectre_USA 7]

i've been looking for this game for a while!!!! where can i find it?

 

Right here! <<-- Click me!

[+Brainless 1]

I try explane something:

 

This is from Wrench’s IsraelME_upgrade ReadMe:

 

"THIS IS FOR WoI -ONLY!!! IT CANNOT BE USED ON ANY OTHER TERRAIN, EXCEPTING THE STOCK ISREALME IN WoI!!!!"

 

And another note in Wrench’s IsraelME_upgrade ReadMe:

"It is designed to use either the Bunyap or Mirage Factory Weapons Pak"

 

According to these notes, you can use Jul2006 weps pack or MF weps pack - merged with MF weps pack for WOI (if you are using just MF weps pack for WOI, there are not included SA-3, Chapparal missiles, etc). That's it I suppose.

 

How merge two different weapons packs see this link (post nm 4 by Sony Tuckson):

http://forum.combatace.com/index.php?showtopic=23529

 

Thanks for replying. Yes I know you can only use the upgrade in WOI which IS where I am using it. I'm using the MF weapons pack and assumed that this would work with the upgrade as per Wrench's README.

 

I'll try 'merging the weapons packs and see if this does the job.

 

UPDATE

 

Well I was about to do the weapons merge and I thought just a minute I’d better put my brain in for this..so I did and then turned it round the right way..and thought for a bit then it suddenly came to me that I didn’t really need to merge these two weapons packs all I needed to do was to manually extract the ‘ingredients’ for the missing misiles from the ’06 weapons pack I had in WOE. This I did. They were:- sams. bmp. relevant ini. Weapons references e.g SA-3, SA-8 & Hawk, SA-3 LOD, SA-8 LOD & Hawk LOD. I then updated the weapons data in the editor and hey presto all the missiles appeared on the rails that were missing yesterday. I also put the missiles on the ChapparralL which had ‘chapparral’ as the missiles which should be MIM-72A and they appeared on the rails like all the other Chapparrals. So now the only two objects I can’t get to show are the HawkL standalone and M48A3. Not bad really.

 

It’s amazing what you can do when you’ve got your brain in isn’t it.

Edited March 25, 2008 by Brainless

[serverandenforcer 33]

Hey guys, I just got WOI over the weekend and noticed that I lose radar lock on my a2a targets and that there are not as many contacts out there as what it says on the radar screen. Has anybody else noticed this as well? This is a first for me in the Thirdwire sims. Never noticed it in WOE or WOV. Is this the implementation of ECM actually working and affecting radar operations? If so, that's freaken cool! Now I have to use HOJ.

[+Dave 2,322]

Hey guys, I just got WOI over the weekend and noticed that I lose radar lock on my a2a targets and that there are not as many contacts out there as what it says on the radar screen. Has anybody else noticed this as well? This is a first for me in the Thirdwire sims. Never noticed it in WOE or WOV. Is this the implementation of ECM actually working and affecting radar operations? If so, that's freaken cool! Now I have to use HOJ.

 

The AI will beam you now to lose radar lock.

[kukulino 1]

UPDATE

 

Well I was about to do the weapons merge and I thought just a minute I’d better put my brain in for this..so I did and then turned it round the right way..and thought for a bit then it suddenly came to me that I didn’t really need to merge these two weapons packs all I needed to do was to manually extract the ‘ingredients’ for the missing misiles from the ’06 weapons pack I had in WOE. This I did. They were:- sams. bmp. relevant ini. Weapons references e.g SA-3, SA-8 & Hawk, SA-3 LOD, SA-8 LOD & Hawk LOD. I then updated the weapons data in the editor and hey presto all the missiles appeared on the rails that were missing yesterday. I also put the missiles on the ChapparralL which had ‘chapparral’ as the missiles which should be MIM-72A and they appeared on the rails like all the other Chapparrals. So now the only two objects I can’t get to show are the HawkL standalone and M48A3. Not bad really.

 

It’s amazing what you can do when you’ve got your brain in isn’t it.

Yes this is another way.

 

It is not necessary merge Weps packs. You can install MF weps pack and it will works right I think (LINK). But there is another MF weps pack just for WOI (LINK). I supposed that you had just this WOI weps pack installed (there are no Sa-3... etc. missiles)... So than is needed merge with another pack.

[TheCeed 0]

Great game ! I have always been a fan of TK's so-called "lite" sims. It seems with every game it gets better and better. With the work around, it runs perfect with VISTA. The following pics shows what I get with my rig;

 

Athlon 64 X2 5200+

ATI X1650SE 512 mb gfx ( with Cat. 8.2 AA 2 , AF 4 Vsync on)

2 gig RAM

Vista Home Premium

 

I have everything maxed out, but shadows turned off.

 

 

where an i donload the workaround?

[DerAlte 0]

where an i donload the workaround?

 

PM sent !!!!

 

 

 

DerAlte

[SkyStrike 15]

Remember that there was some talk earlier about a boxed/CD version of WOI soon to be released sometime...Any news/updates on that?

[+malibu43 142]

Hey guys,

 

I still don't have WOI, and was just curious about something before I buy it.

 

I know initially there were some issues with using WOE/WOV/Add-on aircraft and Terrains in WOI. I know there's a new weps editor and a patch out, so is it possible yet to just dump all my old Aircraft/Terrain/Campaigns into WOI without any major issues, or are there still a lot of little incompatibility issues lurking around?

 

Thanks!

[+suhsjake 11]

If you where to use the weapons pack for WOE and earlier, then you have to open and save the weaponsdata.ini with the new weapons editor, the FM system is updated, the terrian is updated. I would keep WOE and WOI addons separate along with the installs until the new patch for SFP1, WOV, and WOE comes out.