Iranian F-14s in Retrospect

[MigBuster 2,884]

 

 

Back in 2004 a book was released by Osprey that likely caused a few (thousand) Internet forum arguments……………...Iranian F-14 Tomcat units in combat by Tom Cooper and Farzad Bishop.

The information in the book shattered the typical Western held views and perception of what really might have happened during the eight-year Iran Vs Iraq conflict in the 1980s.

The book is probably owned by most Tomcat fans out there and even was referred to positively by both Dave Baranek and his guest Iranian former F-14 pilot (Mikey) in Episode 5 of the Tomcast on YouTube.

 

But what was the controversy all about and how accurate was the information presented?

After all information is usually the first casualty of war and it usually takes decades afterwards to even start scratching the surface.

 

Lack of Information

Osprey books are normally very well researched using the best information available that they can get released into the public domain. That information can often be cross checked especially in the US where more of this information is available.

The problem with the Iran/ Iraq conflict is that most of the official Iraq war records seems to have been lost during the constant state of conflict there. Likewise getting credible information from Iran also involves contacting those who have to remain anonymous due to such things as political persecution and death threats. (Even if they live outside of Iran)

 

Trust

Today Tom Cooper is probably one of the top authorities on Middle Eastern Combat having published many books with leading Historians….. but this book was one of his first and it had listed almost no source references!  You basically had to put trust that Osprey had actually had a look at where this information was coming from.

 

What gets your backs up!

The book is only written from an Iranian point of view and thus, to most of us that does not mean you can dismiss it but you need to be weary that there is always more than one side to every story.

We also have to accept that the information on the conflict was still not great at this point in time and therefore unlike most Osprey books you had to accept that the information was raw and a higher percentage of it was likely wrong.

For an example of the hodgepodge of data, in the chapter “The Fog of Disinformation” it states:

 “It remains unclear exactly how many air-to air kills were scored by IRIAF F-14s between 7 Sept 1980 and 7 July 1988”

 

It then tells us that a Post war Iranian conference concluded that a total of 71 x AIM-54s had been fired with a further 10 lost (Due to crashes/defection etc)

The conference also determined the F-14 had a total of 30 x confirmed kills with 16 of those confirmed AIM-54 kills. The author then states that they have further evidence for 130 confirmed kills total including 40 with the AIM-54.

Then if we move to the Appendices, it lists another figure - around 58 “confirmed kills” with the AIM-54 and around 159 total confirmed kills. [more on that later]

 

So then the hodgepodge of information gives a total that might be in the range of 30 to 159 for total claims, and AIM-54 claims might range from 16 to 58 [okay]

 

Accuracy

The book was the first time most found out that perhaps the F-14s were used in combat and that stories of the US sabotaging all the missiles etc were not completely true. This is one thing in the book at least that is backed up in some other interviews like here:

 

What is the biggest myth about the Iranian F-14s?

 

“The most tiresome is that the departing US personnel stationed in Iran managed to sabotage Iranian F-14 radar, electronics and Phoenix missiles before leaving Iran in the ensuing days after the 1979 revolution. Let me tell you that I was a young officer during those days at Esfahan Khatami air base. Our wing commanders and senior officers made sure this never happened. We lined up departing American personnel before boarding their TWA aircraft and inspected them all.

 

From: F-14 Tomcat pilot Col. Fereydoun A. Mazandarani (rtd)

 

 

 

The Appendices and the art of the Kill

Although there is probably a lot of useful information in the book the one area that always seems a tad flaky was the Appendices which lists 159 confirmed kills in total for the Iranian F-14A. It does at least list some sources for the information.

What we can do is take information released more recently (including newer text from T Cooper) from the Iraqi side and see what has changed and if it can be matched up in anyway to these confirmed kills.

 

 

In particular

•          Iraqi Mirages in Combat (2018, Miguel Garcia, Independent)
•          Iraqi Mirages (2019, Tom Cooper & Milos Sipos, Helion)

 

 

 

 

 

 

A confirmed kill is not a confirmed Kill

In the history of aerial warfare, the difference between confirmed kills stated by one side only and the real actual kills has been like the difference between Jupiter and the Sun!

In fact, ridiculous claims are even partly to blame for major blunders such as the USAAF sending in unescorted bombers for so long over Germany in 1943 to their inevitable slaughter. After all, why do you need escort fighters if your bomber crews claims show they have already shot down the entire Luftwaffe!

A good airforce should only claim a confirmed kill based on multiple criteria – even gun camera film in the past has not been enough evidence of an actual shootdown. Pilots in the stress of combat are extremely bad eyewitnesses and here we have a conflict where pilots are firing missiles BVR. One explosion in the distance or a radar blip disappearing are not evidence of an actual shootdown.

So, a “confirmed kill” by one side is usually better described as a “Claim” instead.

 

33 claims on Mirage F1s………. hmm

•          That’s right, the Appendices in the book list 33 F-14A “confirmed kills” (claims) over Mirage F1s.
•          (Garcia M) only lists a total of 32 Mirages lost over the period to all causes!
•          Out of that, only 2 of those dates match any of those 33 events. [what!]
•          So is that 2 actual losses only out of 33 claims listed!! [Oh dear].

 

 

But wait you say that independent book from Garcia M cannot be much use, can it?

Well, the thing is the 2019 (T Cooper / Sipos) book actually matches the information in the (Garcia M) book closely and almost disowns the 2004 data like a child that doesn’t meet its ideals.

The (T Cooper / Sipos) book does mention another 2 of the events out of the list of 33 but in both cases states the missiles fired by the F-14 missed the Mirages.

So where does the figure of 33 comes from? - Is it coincidence that the total number of Mirage F1 losses (Garcia M) to all causes comes to about 32 for that period??

 

 

Better information?

Either way both of the newer books provide information that Iranian F-14As may have shot down 7 or 8 Mirage F1s during the conflict [Yes, slightly less than 33]. Likewise, they also show that Mirage F1s may have shot down 4 x F-14As (a 5^th F-14A was hit but flew back to base)

Is that accurate? – only time will tell but at least the numbers are going in the right direction [down]

 

Other things noted in the 2004 book are, the Appendices also show most of the Sidewinders and Sparrows used as the type AIM-9P and AIM-7E-4. The more recent information suggests that Iran only had the AIM-9J and AIM-7E-2 and were essentially using ones supplied for their F-4s which had degraded capability because of it.

 

Also, on page 76 the 2004 book tells us (from the Iranian side) that Iraq received Super 530D and Magic 2 missiles. The recent information in both newer books suggest Iraq only received Magic 1 and Super 530F missiles and nearly all their claims were using the Super 530F.

 

So, perhaps some progress has been made in the past 2 decades because instead of these authors shouting at people on internet forums (yes, some did) there is maybe a bit more calm and willingness to look at both sides and the actual data available.

The final word on the book is that its real value was not only to highlight that the conflict was very different to published stories about it at the time, but also may have helped inspire those more passionate to get out there and start digging for better information.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sources

·         Iraqi Mirages in Combat (2018, Garcia M, Independent)

·         Iraqi Mirage (2019, Cooper T, Sipos M, Helion)

·         Iranian F-14 Tomcat Units in combat (2004, Cooper T, Bishop F, Osprey)

·         Air Combat Memoirs of the Iranian Air Force Pilots (2015, Ryan, K, Bishop F, Independent)

·         Schweinfurt-Regensburg 1943 (2020, Marshall Michel III, Osprey)

 

The Tomcast Episode 5: Iranian F-14s (2020, Baranek, Online):  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q5Y_ai4s2Y

 

Interview with Fereydoun Mazandarani (2020, Hushkit, Online):

https://hushkit.net/2020/04/07/interview-with-the-greatest-living-fighter-ace-f-14-tomcat-pilot-col-rtd-fereydoun-a-mazandarani/

[macelena 1,070]

As a side note, I've always been impressed by the Mirage F1. Reading specs alone it doesn't feel like it would perform as good as it did historically against MiG-23s and F-14s

[Sokol 444]

many thanks to Migbuster for your research and careful argumentation.

as for Tom Cooper he sure is one of the leading public experts on the Middle East conflicts, but he often seems to take first person accounts as truth and at face value.  btw, he sports a very heavy bias against Soviet equipment.  

as for MiG-23 vs Mirage F1 I remember having read that South-african Mirages were totally  outclassed by Cuban MiGs in the "bush / Angolan war" during the 1980ies.

cheers sokol

 

 

Edited January 24, 2022 by Sokol
spelling

[+Menrva 4,200]

During the development of Operation Desert Storm: 30th Anniversary Edition, we found ourselves with so many sketchy details on the IrAF and the order of battle of Iraqi air units. Tom Cooper's data helped us quite a lot, but I personally went further to countercheck it with other sources I found with time. I still keep backups of them. It turns out I clarified few unit names in the IrAF, which aircraft they flew at the time of the Gulf War and on which airports they were based temporarily. It's a pity we do not have incontrovertible info; that 8 year long war left terrible wounds both in history of man and of aviation.

Edited January 24, 2022 by Menrva

[jeanba 1,920]

22 hours ago, Sokol said:

 

as for MiG-23 vs Mirage F1 I remember having read that South-african Mirages were totally  outclassed by Cuban MiGs in the "bush / Angolan war" during the 1980ies.

cheers sokol

Yes, but actually, the Mirage F1 were early versions which were not fully updated due to the arm embargo (and the AZ was a strike aircraft, not really fit for ATA) , the missiles were also old and did not have proper maintenance, while the Cubal MIg-23 were latest MLA version : there was therefore a big technicological difference

[Stratos 3,188]

Thanks for the review, apreciatted. Unfortunately Tom Cooper as Sokol already said has a very strong bias against old USSR and then Russia, so sometimes his analisis are not really that useful.

[+streakeagle 871]

Tom Cooper has a strong bias... period. But the other information I have has a strong USA bias and the truth is often somewhere in between. I have no sources for air combat history other than these books, crappy tv shows, and the internet. So, I take it all in and filter it as best as I can given that I am biased like anyone else. I have always had a strong interest in May 10, 1972 since I owned the tactical air combat board game, Air War, that had both the Death of Major Lodge and Duke Cunningham vs Col. Toon as scenarios. Tom Cooper and István Toperczer tell a slightly different version of the death of Major Lodge, and at this point I believe their version is probably more accurate than the US version. I take everything either of them reports with a grain of salt because they are essentially echoing Communist and Islamic propaganda, but that helps even out the US propaganda I have always had to accept.

Edited February 3, 2022 by streakeagle

[Slant6 21]

OT I know but Cooper (and David Nicolle who’ve co-authored Osprey books about Arab MiGs vs Israel) have an admitted anti-Israel bias. Like most Americans I’m not happy about that.

[madvad 653]

I have this and other Tom Cooper books, but I have to admit that nowadays I'm afraid to trust everything he says.
I had him added to my Facebook network, and one day I saw him posting a video of a fire in a forest, where he said it was in my country, but those who know the country know that it was not filmed there, the people in the video even spoke of another language.

By pointing this out, in a polite way, he came to attack me in a rude way, then deleted my comment and blocked me.
My mutual friends with him said that everyone who pointed out the error in his publication did the same.

Therefore, I can no longer trust those who apparently publish fake news knowing that it is fake news.

Not to mention that over time, I saw that he has very orthodox political positions, closer to an extinct red flag block with the hammer and sickle...

[Stratos 3,188]

Regarding Iranian units, anyone know a good book or article detailing the Iranian Cobra operations during the war? I tried it before with Iraqi Hinds without luck, so for Iranian sounds even more difficult.

[+Crusader 2,101]

This..

[Stratos 3,188]

Thanks a lot! searching for it

[Stratos 3,188]

Had to purchase second hand from a shop on the middle of nowhere in England, but hey! Finally is at home and It worth its weight in gold!