Need experts advice on creating a template.

[+Geary 1,889]

For many years I've had a great deal of respect for modders who make the planes and objects for flight sim games.

 

I've also had a healthy respect for those that dress the objects in so many different skins.

 

As an amateur skinner I've recently I've learned the value of a good template.

 

There are lots of great templates here that make skinning easier for beginners like me.  Many only need a few layers clicked on or off and a splash of paint to create a new skin.  In some cases, adjusting decals took more work that painting.

 

Since I can't find a template for the ThirdWire F-8 Crusader, I'm thinking of making one.

 

I have some basic experience in Photoshop (CS4) dealing with and making layers.  And I've tinkered with some basic templates.

 

I'm guessing the panel and rivet layers will be the most difficult, but I could use some expert advice on things to do and not do.

 

Any and all help appreciated.

 

 

 

Geary

 

 

 

 

[Wrench 9,848]

the way I made (ok, make) them, especially in cases like the 3w ones (or even 3rd party ones) is all the same.

 

I keep ALL my templates in a separate folder on the /C, called oddly enough! Templates.

 

so what you do is:

 

extract all the skin bmps (or jpgs depending)

place them in a new folder named for the aircraft. We'll use you Crud example. Call it -this is how I do my SF2s - sf2_3w_f8_crusader

 

then, open each one in PS or whatever, blow them up to at MINIMUM!!! 2048 x 2048. Sometimes, 4096 is best, if you have worn out eyes like I do.

 

Then, start creating the layers.

One for panel lines

One for Rivets

One for details (but that is optional, as the eraser tool can come in hand for that later)

don't worry about weathering and 'clouds' and such ... that comes much later

 

Then, - this is cool trick part- duplicate the base background layer, and rename it to 'inverted background'. Then, INVERT the colors.

this will make the panel and rivet line their opposite colors (white now, instead of faded black).

 

Then start on which ever layer suits you.

 

I'd download those I've done for the 3W birds; the A-7, A-6, F-16A Netz, and whatever others there are. Study those and some of the trick will become apparent.

The real bitch is, you will be doing some extrapolations as to where rivets and lines begin and end. This is because of the 'noise' layer TK added. It has a tendancey to blur details badly

 

be ready for long hours, crossed eyes, some frustration, overflowing ashtrays (if you still smoke). Keep a beverage of choice nearby, and unload all fireams, locking the ammo away. Give to the key to someone trustworthy, that won't relinquish it until you're done.

 

good luck!!

 

 

 

(it really isn't as hard as I've made it sound)

Edited January 26, 2014 by Wrench

[mdatelmi 124]

Interesting topic here!

[Stratos 3,192]

Yes, very interesting topic.

[Wrench 9,848]

no different that has been explained several dozen times to many people

 

excepting that some people actually have the gumption to try it, especially when explained in a step-by-step from those with knowledge and experience.

sorta like the hex editing thread from a week or so ago, eh??

[+Sundowner 4,831]

I'd better chirp in here, any templates made by me are NOT the best way to learn, my stuff is usually pretty confusing as I don't bother to label all the layers adequately so you can sometimes get fairly disheartened with them.

There are some excellent templates in the download section made by folks that label things as they should be,take a look at any,even if it's not the plane you want, you'll soon learn how to get the results you're after...…dont be afraid to experiment, take a look at simmerspaintshop for some excellent tuturiols, it won't all happen overnight but you'll enjoy the end result.

[Spinners 15,986]

 

then, open each one in PS or whatever, blow them up to at MINIMUM!!! 2048 x 2048. Sometimes, 4096 is best, if you have worn out eyes like I do.

 

I hear you Bro...

[stuntman 170]

Some useful links for skinning (including riveting): http://www.simmerspaintshop.com/forums/forum37-photoshop-tutorials/

[+RAVEN 414]

My two cents here, another trick I used on TW skins is make a another copy layer ( Like Wrench said) , but use this one to play with the ' Brightness and Contrast' to isolate lines and outlines then grab them with the 'Magicwand' and paint into a new layer. Then there's the 'bang head on keyboard ' reprint pixel by bloody pixel. :)

[+Geary 1,889]

 

be ready for long hours, crossed eyes, some frustration, overflowing ashtrays (if you still smoke). Keep a beverage of choice nearby, and unload all fireams, locking the ammo away. Give to the key to someone trustworthy, that won't relinquish it until you're done.

 

good luck!!

 

 

 

Thanks, Wrench,  I already dreaded this like a colonoscopy. 

 

  Although your tip on inverting a background layer copy sounds interesting as does bumping up the resolution.

 

 

Sundowner,

 

  Your templates may not be 'adequately' labeled, but once I decode your layers it's easy going from there.  Yours are some of the best out there.  Already learned much from them.  Thanks.

 

 

Stuntman,

 

   Been to simmers paint shop a lot.  I go there often to browse.  Picked up a bunch of good tips there.

 

 

Raven,

 

  Good tip on the 'Brightness and Contrast' layers.  Should come in real handy.

 

 

 

Thanks to all for your tips and tricks.

 

 

 

In particular, though:

 

What size, type brushes do you use for panel lines and rivets?  And what spacing, pixel sizes for those layers?  ( I found a free round rivet brush online, but by the time I size it to 1 or 2 pixels it just looks square.)

 

Do you duplicate the layers, recolor, offset and blur some of them for that 3D look? 

 

What color do you make your lines and rivets?

 

Remember, I use Photoshop CS4.

 

 

Thanks, again...

[Wrench 9,848]

panel and rivets brushes vary, again depending the template size. For a 4096 (like I'm using for Cocas' P-47C), I use a 2 pix round for the panel lines. Color is pure black for both. Opacity changes will do the rest before saving as a bmp or jpg for in game use.

 

For the rivets, I use a 2 pix square, anti-alias OFF, spacing -again depending- anything from 400 pix to 500 pix. Best to experiment and 'see how it looks'.

Most of the time, given the game scaling, it's the right size.

 

Speaking of scaling, if one stands next to real aircraft, in the case I studied was Chino's P-47M with a camo scheme, after about 15-20 feet from the aircraft, you can't see the rivets. On natural metal, not that much further. Panel lines about the same. Don't forget, they too, sit flush on the aircraft skin surface.

 

remember, after approx. 1940, 99.9% of all aircraft are using flush rivets. The 3d effect isn't needed, so duplicate and blurr the rivet layer, place it BELOW the 'hard' rivets and use it a collected dirt and dust.

 

main panel and rivets I fade to 25% and then check in game, adjusting as needed. the "blurred" layer usually between 35-40%. Again, study the layers in the uploaded templates

 

my advantage, expecially for WW2 aircraft,  is many hours hands-on studying examples of them at the Chino museuams. And very rarely, when stuff showed up here at Santa Monica Airport, and sat by the Museaum of Flying.

 

and Ant, there ain't nothing wrong with YOUR templates!

[+Geary 1,889]

Thought I'd start out small.

 

This is the DAT OH-6A.  The original template is one page.  It's just white outlined images of both sides of the helicopter and a few odds and ends such as the propeller blades, etc.  A small blank canvas.

 

Any and all comments, suggestions, tips and critiques are welcome.

 

 

 

[Wrench 9,848]

it it just me, or the angle of the shot, that the lower fin is not attached to the tail boom?

 

(we've had lots of Hughes 500s in and out of SMAP over the years)

 

hard to see anything on the skin...

[+RAVEN 414]

Yup, it's floating. I started making one last year and quit caus I found one I DL before the rift. Hmm, no ETA on restart, but we could use a new one. If Geary wants to skin a new one from scratch , hint :D

Edited January 27, 2014 by RAVEN

[Wrench 9,848]

and we all know HOW much fun that is!!!

[+Soulfreak 6,524]

From Time to time it is! *gg*

For example The new KAW F-84E/G temps I did with a lot of fun.

[+Geary 1,889]

it it just me, or the angle of the shot, that the lower fin is not attached to the tail boom?

 

(we've had lots of Hughes 500s in and out of SMAP over the years)

 

hard to see anything on the skin...

 

Yeah,   I didn't pick this one because it's a great model, although a little TLC goes a long way.

 

I chose this because it's a small, simple, clean, one page template (nothing but black and white outlines).  I figured it's a good template to begin learning from scratch on.  Good test template.

 

It started out as a one page/one layer template.  Mine's up to about 20 layers now.  A few of those are bits.  Most are lines and rivets. Some dirt and scratches layers.  Some paint layers.

 

 

Yup, it's floating. I started making one last year and quit caus I found one I DL before the rift. Hmm, no ETA on restart, but we could use a new one. If Geary wants to skin a new one from scratch , hint :D

 

I suppose I could give it a try, but I want to finish my F-8E Crusader template first.  Thing's driving me like my ex-wife with a to-do list on a Saturday morning.

[+RAVEN 414]

I'll get back to you on that, right now my oven is full. I'm still updating the Hurri's and I was just imformed of some things i missed. sigh!

[+russouk2004 6,958]

look at existing templates...and look at individual layers   panels rivets etc etc  and if needed copy a panel layer and paste as new image to see what the thing looks like...

my jug template for example had originally over 100 layers..i use them to move stuf around trying out stuff,then when happy move them to where they need to go...and remove all I dont need\dislike

[+Geary 1,889]

From Time to time it is! *gg*

For example The new KAW F-84E/G temps I did with a lot of fun.

 

Soulfreak,

 

   When does the fun start?  Do I need to be drunk at 0200?  Cause I can do that.

 

I'll get back to you on that, right now my oven is full. I'm still updating the Hurri's and I was just imformed of some things i missed. sigh!

 

Raven,

 

   I'm in no hurry for more work right now either, but let me know if I can help.

 

 

look at existing templates...and look at individual layers   panels rivets etc etc  and if needed copy a panel layer and paste as new image to see what the thing looks like...

my jug template for example had originally over 100 layers..i use them to move stuf around trying out stuff,then when happy move them to where they need to go...and remove all I dont need\dislike

 

russouk2004,

 

   These damn layers multiply like rabbits.  I blinked, which I'm doing a lot now BTW, and ten more layers were in my template.

 

   Your jug template was the very first I used to change a skin.  A few clicks and I was done.   I can see where you may have had 100 layers.

 

   Should I be seeing rivets on everything I can still focus on? 

 

 

  

 

  I have a WIP.  Only close to finishing the first of 5 texture panels.  Looks like it'll take about a day per texture file.

 

  I could use some critiques.  Don't want to start on the other 4 textures till I'm sure what I want to do. 

 

  If anyone would like to try the template, PM me.  You'll need Photoshop or any paint program that can read .psd files.

 

  Only the green front end of the plane is done.

 

 

 

[+Soulfreak 6,524]

Soulfreak,

 

   When does the fun start?  Do I need to be drunk at 0200?  Cause I can do that.

 

 

The time doesn´t count. The things that count are: enough Beer or Cuba-Libre, Good Music and a good feeling. ;-)

[+russouk2004 6,958]

 

Only the green front end of the plane is done.

looks ok so far...maybe a tad more darker panel lines..unless you add a bumpmap then they are ok as is.

[+Geary 1,889]

russouk2004,

 

   Thanks. The opacity for the panel lines is at 21% so it's an easy fix to darken them.

 

    So how do we ad a bumpmap?

 

 

Here's what I have so far.