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You may want to see this - A message from 3rd Wire, CROWFUNDING campaign for Sf2 update

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10 hours ago, Menrva said:

I  am not sure about updating the game to DirectX 12, though. That means it will most likely drop support for DirectX 9 and 10, and it's just what my video card is capable of. With the game using DirectX 12, I wouldn't even be able to start it. I know that I need to upgrade (if only I could afford it now), but at the same time I hope he will always keep the DirectX 9 and 10 as an option for those with weaker GPUs. The game works good enough on Windows 10 as it is. I'd rather spend the funding on fixing broken AI behaviour with guided bombs, external dispensers, and probably re-add those features he originally had envisioned since SF1, ramp starts, and more complete radio chatter.

I think it's safe to say the new Microsoft Flight Sim and P3DV4 will be DirectX 12.  That's good enough reason to upgrade I would think.

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10 hours ago, yakarov79 said:

For what end? Why downgrade object quality ? As i said before many times. We do not need new objects. This can be managed by modders here.

Really want legal Su-34 and more late-model Flankers.  That's why.

Also J-20 and such... we have a great JF-10 that just needs some skins.

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4 hours ago, yakarov79 said:

So we stop modding and they will start doing their job? Modders are doing it for free in free time. So they can release it whenever it suits them. It is not the fault of modder that Mirage can be better nicer generally super, than the planned stock version.

You missed my point. I did not say anything like "stop modding and they will start doing their job". It was specifically the two aircraft I mentioned. To repeat, I felt the timing was unfair on TK.

 

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Just now, JosefK said:

Really want legal Su-34 and more late-model Flankers.  That's why.

Are you aware that without engine upgrade, features of your dream Su-34 are futile? Without proper A/G engine capabilities...same results will be achieved with any other model. 

Let's make a deal  - I will make you Su-34 with cockpit...you give me game engine update. 

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Just now, Spinners said:

To repeat, I felt the timing was unfair on TK.

Can be... but we have XXI century and knowledge of communications, cooperation, outsourcing, emails, twitters, faces, and books.. etc...With little effort, even game developer can contact the modding community.  :ok:

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3 hours ago, Stratos said:

Maybe we should tell him that everyone is using it in WIN10, so he can use ALL the money to add new features???

What people think of this?

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18 minutes ago, yakarov79 said:

Can be... but we have XXI century and knowledge of communications, cooperation, outsourcing, emails, twitters, faces, and books.. etc...With little effort, even game developer can contact the modding community.  :ok:

That's the whole point of my post. Imagine this...

TK announces a new title, let's call it SF2:Libya with the F-111 as the centrepiece.

The modding community then announces a revamp of the F-111.

Is that fair on TK?

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Spinners, I do not recall the Mirage F1 being worked on here soon after TK planned Expansion 3. IIIRC it took a while before the community made a new Mirage F1 model. It's not the timing that was harsh on TK, rather bad development decisions on SF2NA (the new terrain engine didn't work as intended), game breaking bugs on SF2NA release and the constant issue of pirate sites meant that TK didn't gain as much as he deserved during the years.

As far as I know, some .ini tweaks that used to work on old SF2 patch levels no longer work, not to mention player missiles being more powerful than AI ones and other issues that were introduced rather than fixed, because TK decided to do things his own way, without listening to the modding community. Is that fair on a modding community that has long supported him? I'm just playing devil's advocate.

Edited by Menrva
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48 minutes ago, yakarov79 said:

Are you aware that without engine upgrade, features of your dream Su-34 are futile? Without proper A/G engine capabilities...same results will be achieved with any other model. 

Let's make a deal  - I will make you Su-34 with cockpit...you give me game engine update. 

I hope TW is listening!

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$25,000 USD is the minimum we need to cover the cost of development and testing. At this level funding, the update will simply be Windows 10/DirectX 12 update with no other fixes, enhancement or improvement.

last bit is ominous....hmmm   "with no other fixes, enhancement or improvement."...whats the point then of just dx support with no improvements...seems pointless exercise to me.for 25K

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Although I welcome further developement of SF2, this "Project" is still somewhat shady to me.

It seems that the 25k is just for new DirectX-Support. I don't have a clue about VR or that stuff, that maybe needs that Support, but I doubt that the vast majority is using it.

I think I will spend some money, but I think there are things more important to take care of, than VR-Support, as the game runs well on W10 already and the engine will still be limited as it was.

I also agree with Spinners on the F-14/Mirage F1 bit. I remember a poll, where the aircraft was asked, that Exp.3 should be centrred around and the F1 won. Shortly after that, there was info on a F1 from the community. I always asked myself why TK should invest more money in Exp.3 and a new model then. Lately the 2 new Tu-160 models are an equal situation, although not involving TK.

I also do not fully agree with the "let modders handle models" theory. One thing for sure we have very talented modders here and I admire their skills! But there are many limitations: number and free time of modders, personal interest to name 3. And so I always welcome any additional models from other sources, than CA-modders. I'd rather have 3 models, that are 85% accurate, than 1 that is 99%. See it that way...in the first case, you leave room for other people to start modding or improve their skills in modding, trying to make a good model better. Although it is much easier today to add models to SF2 through mue's Blender-Exporter (again and again a big Thanks!!!), it is still difficult to "just" make a new plane. I have started several and I lack the skills here and there to find a solution for some problems of modelmaking.

To make a long story short. TK gets some money, although I'm not really convinced :wink:

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6 hours ago, russouk2004 said:

last bit is ominous....hmmm   "with no other fixes, enhancement or improvement."...whats the point then of just dx support with no improvements...seems pointless exercise to me.for 25K

That's why I ask, we as a comunity, should ask for:

A: bypass totally the Win10 upgrade as after all the game already works on win10

B: Use all the money to fix bugs and add features.

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Just one sentence,,,   1. A day late, and a dollar short !

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If anyone is shopping for a lite flight sim then the Third Wire store will be disappointing to anyone with W10 as it only has two simple games plus a space sim with all three requiring an Xbox controller. Perusing around the store further they will then see exactly what they are looking for (SF2 series) but for W7 and earlier. Surely, it is the storekeeper's decision to upgrade these to W10 and recoup the costs with fresh sales - no different to the normal risk/reward of any entreprenneur and, indeed, what TK famously did 'back in the day' with his beat-up compact car and $0.99 hamburgers.

I've supported TK and Third Wire by buying everything for SF1 and SF2 (all games and all DLC) with a few SF1 titles twice (discs then downloads) but I'm struggling with this.

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On 06/09/2019 at 2:08 AM, russouk2004 said:

exactly lol  maybe 25K will make a nice holiday lol

It's a "keep it all" campaign. Read the terms and conditions. "If your campaign uses the Keep It All (“KIA”) payment model, you always keep the money you raise. It doesn’t matter how much you raise or how long it takes."

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The modding community is the only reason why the SF PC series still exist, and draw new people to it.  How many of us practically begged on the TW forum for upgrades, problem fixes,,,,and at the end TW made it harder to MOD , and put us on ignore !!!! If they are willing to address those past issues , I will contribute.... Do I sound angry ?   Good !

Edited by Veltro2k
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3 hours ago, Nyghtfall said:

I also do not fully agree with the "let modders handle models" theory....

I only bring back my ''theory' when someone is dreaming about importing objects from mobile games...which is pointless. Plus point is - there are much more important thing to upgrade/update than models. 

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2 hours ago, yakarov79 said:

Plus point is - there are much more important thing to upgrade/update than models. 

Thats true, but for that we need either TK or someone to play with the code. 😉 And up until know he has shown little interest...no options are few.

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I personally will be suprised if it goes over 10K  maybe even 5K from what I see...I think this update is pie in the sky tbh.....hope proven wrong but I think its not gonna happen

If indeed he gets 25k then im going to build the moon....

Edited by russouk2004
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then im going to build the moon....

at 100% scale, or the stock 3W 63% scale??

 

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Not sure how I feel about this. I'm fully engulfed in DCS. It has its problems BUT it's more complete for my needs than SF at this point in time. Make sure you all re read that last part. He would need to do some serious upgrading to Win 10 usability and yes DX12 would have to be a player. I'm going to have to ponder this for some time. In all honesty I enjoyed my break from simming and I learned that simming politics are the bane of this hobbies existence. 

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