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MAKO69

Royal Navy and Royal Airforce

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Have all the RAF Harriers been replaced by the Typhoon, likewise W.T.F. is the Fleet Air Arm using right now?

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Joint force Harrier (All RAF and FAA Harriers) was withdrawn after the 2010 SDSR... the repacement hasnt arrived yet, currently the FAA is Helo only.

PM Cameron at the time of the withdrawl stated "we cannot forsee a situation requiring the use of carrier based airpower in the next 10 years"...

 

4 weeks latter we were flying 8 hour sorties to Lybia from Italy in Tornados, launch to target around 3.5 hours, the French navy flying from the CDG launch to taget 20 minutes....

 

 

Craig

 

 

 

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The last RAF Harriers are out of service since 2011 and last I heard the USMC had bought them all for a bargain price.

 

The Last Carrier Ark Royal was sent for scrapping in 2011 - so the FAA only fly choppers off HMS Ocean with the Army Apaches as in Libya.

 

The FAA will be flying F-35Bs off 2 new Carriers in the next 5 years - well maybe......

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The last RAF Harriers are out of service since 2011 and last I heard the USMC had bought them all for a bargain price.

 

The Last Carrier Ark Royal was sent for scrapping in 2011 - so the FAA only fly choppers off HMS Ocean with the Army Apaches as in Libya.

 

The FAA will be flying F-35Bs off 2 new Carriers in the next 5 years - well maybe......

Buster I read this but, I havn't read of even a short term plan for the RN, what was wrong with the RN Hariers, the Govt just didn't want them?

Edited by MAKO69

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The cost may have to do with this choice. The Harrier is asking for a pretty good level of maintenance. And perhaps also because the aircrafts ingaged in the current conflict were based on land, why continue using FRS.2 while GR.9 could do it ? But this is just an idea, I have no source on which to lean.

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The FAA is getting nothing till the F-35Bs it seems - thats it really sad to say - reliant on the US to provide fixed wing air where the RAF cannot cover - aka quite a few places.

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What a cock up. The operational types in the RAF and RN must be going bananas.

 

We've got governments all over the place bailing out greedy b______ds in pin-stripe suits, meanwhile the men and women in uniform are getting shafted. Let's hope most of the world's various tin-pot generals and dictators are asleep at the wheel.

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PM Cameron at the time of the withdrawl stated "we cannot forsee a situation requiring the use of carrier based airpower in the next 10 years"...

 

4 weeks latter we were flying 8 hour sorties to Lybia from Italy in Tornados, launch to target around 3.5 hours, the French navy flying from the CDG launch to taget 20 minutes....

 

 

Craig

betcha he didn't forsee that one!

wasn't there something in the news recently also about going back to stovl F-35s instead of catobar? would kind of scotch the deal you guys were gonna have with the french to share a CVN....

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PM Cameron at the time of the withdrawl stated "we cannot forsee a situation requiring the use of carrier based airpower in the next 10 years"...

 

4 weeks latter we were flying 8 hour sorties to Lybia from Italy in Tornados, launch to target around 3.5 hours, the French navy flying from the CDG launch to taget 20 minutes...

 

 

Pollies everywhere are just hopeless aren't they? Like George Dubya jumping on to the deck of a carrier to declare a war is over... just forgot to tell the bad guys.

 

Our PM once screwed the entire air force so that now all we have is a handful of Orions, Hercs and helos... and I liked her! :blink:

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This is typical SNAFU, if you look back at the history of our Armed Forces, all the way back to even as far as the Crimean War, if not before, consecutive penny pinching governments have shafted our fighting forces, they penny pinch, and make ill advised descisions. I think that HMG should all ( every man and woman jack of 'em ) be bundled into the back of a couple of Herc's, and flown out to Afganistan, and get stuck out on a 6 month deployment out there, then maybe....ands only maybe, will they get an idea, of what our guys and gals need on the frontline. hardly any of our M.P.'s have served in the Forces, and they havent got a damn clue, but then, they dont have a clue what it is like to be a " normal " peasant do they ?

The Harrier, is a superlative airframe, so good in fact that we sold it to our friends and allies the Americans, who developed it even further ( using British Aerospace engineers ) From what I understand the US Marines love 'em, hell I love 'em, I worked with them enough, being ex RAF Regiment, and deploying with them on many occasions. Without the Harrier we would have been screwed royally in the Falklands ( hmmmm lets hope that little bushfire war never kicks off again eh ? ) But noooooooo....lets bin a perfectly good Aircraft, and buy errrrrrrr....I know....Typhoons !!! because we need interceptors dont we !! because the Tornado isnt any use is it ?.......just like the F15 isnt ????.....sorry being sarcastic !!!

And finally..who had the wonderful bloody idea of sharing CV's with the French ? Yeah, that's gonna work really well isnt it ? Since when did the UK and France EVER see eye to eye on anything ?

 

 

PER ARDUA

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If i remember right the britsh sold their last Harriers to the USMC. THe USMC used them as spare part depot (damn what means Ersatzteilspender on english :dntknw: )

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betcha he didn't forsee that one!

wasn't there something in the news recently also about going back to stovl F-35s instead of catobar? would kind of scotch the deal you guys were gonna have with the french to share a CVN....

 

Yes, the cost to fit the new carriers with full cat gear was spiraling upwards, and it became cheaper once again to get the B (along with B getting out of its development hell that it had been in).

I never heard they would "share" a CV, they were going to share a common design. I can't imagine time sharing an aircraft carrier! The logistics would be so difficult.

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Well the Fleet Air Arm still has at least one fixed-wing ac left, you'll probably see it at the Diamond Jubilee Flypast, see attached pic.

 

 

Speaking of the Flypast, in 1990 the RAF mustered 168 ac from all operational commands for the Battle of Britain 50th Anniversary Flypast. That despite the fact that deployments to the Gulf were already gathering pace following the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait.

 

Count how many RAF ac show up for the Diamond Jubilee Flypast. That will illustrate most graphically how the Service has been decimated in recent years.

 

Mike

post-15237-0-78963800-1338576275.jpg

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What and where are the FAA pilots doing, likewise the RAF harrier pilots?

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They were given redundancy payoffs I think - so have had to find jobs elsewhere - or maybe to ld to come back when the FAA has aircraft again.

 

As for what they are doing now - Suspect they are waiting for Jet Thunder to be released

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Our PM once screwed the entire air force so that now all we have is a handful of Orions, Hercs and helos... and I liked her! :blink:

 

That act by Mrs Clarke was in many ways just as short sighted as the 2010 SDSR. I can kind of understand part of the reasoning, I mean your Kahus were in a similar situation to our Pigs: They would never be deployed overseas during any kind of active service outside or training or co-operative events... so what's the point of having an asset that won't be used? You know, amalgamating our respective AFs would benefit both of our countries. You guys would get your teeth back, we would have access to a wealth of NZDF assets (facilities, staff, etc), we could offset some maintenance to NZ with it's cheaper dollar, neither side would suffer from the loss of skills sets to the private sectors or off shore, etc. It's just a shame our military planners here suffer from a myopic short sightedness almost as bad as that of the Cameron Government's in the UK. I wouldn't be surprised to see the RAF and FAA still looking skeletal come 2018/19. When Treasury and planners take money away from defence in a popular or pandering gesture, it's very difficult to get said money back. Once it's been diverted to someone else's pockets, they won't let you take it back. So, on that basis, I wouldn't be surprised seeing the UK lean a lot more on it's close allies or even actually go through with this proposition of interoperability between the Royal and French navies, irrespective of whether either is using the B or C model of the F-35.

 

What and where are the FAA pilots doing, likewise the RAF harrier pilots?

 

Signing up to other air services, the USMC, etc.

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Count how many RAF ac show up for the Diamond Jubilee Flypast. That will illustrate most graphically how the Service has been decimated in recent years.

 

Probably the most disappointing thing about the flypast is that the Vulcan XH558 was scheduled to lead the flypast similarly to the following video. Unfortunately, it's two port engines were damaged before take off, Monday week ago and sadly she's been grounded since. That would have been just as epic a fly by as this in 2K2. :(

 

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What a sad day in commercial aviation history, when the Concorde had stopped flying. :sad: To date the the most beautiful fusion of engineering and artful design, all other commerical aviation aircraft look like uninspired trash haulers compared to her. Sustained Mach 2 flight, until recently no fast jet (save the SR-71) could keep up with her for two hours plus at Mach 2.

 

Everything looked just perfectly right about her.

Edited by Atreides

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Signing up to other air services, the USMC, etc.

 

Dont forget sign ups to the French Navy as well ! :grin:

Edited by Atreides
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I still state they should put the new Electric slingers on the pointy end and go F-18's and Hawkeyes... far cheaper oh hang on wait BAe who are building the Carriers now state that it will cost an extra 2 Billion Pounds to do said job which would be just about the cost saving of going Hornets and Hawkeyes... BAe have a lot to answer for in this screw up as well as the UK Government...

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Funny that you mention the Superbug option last December that is exactly what Air Forces monthly had mentioned as well. And I agree that it is the better option.

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Unfortunately, obscenely expensive stealthy platforms are the must have items that, economic crisis or not, air forces are selling their souls to purchase right now. For the prices AFs are paying for capable stealth platforms these days, the stealth should work like Romulan cloaking devices.

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